Hare Krsna ,
Who is devotee ? How to identify ?
Is it neccessary that initiation will make you a devotee ?
in kaliyuga why do many disciples are made by single guru , when scriptures tells there is no guru
in kaliyuga ..
Even lord chaitanya had very counted number of disciples ..
Replies
A pure devotee like AC Bhaktivedanta Sawami Prabhupada are very rare. They are self effulgent, like the Sun. Easy to recognize a pure devotee.
When a pure devotee is not available, one can accept a guru who is a Sadhu, following all 4 regulative principles and does not chant 16 rounds offensively. If they are talking to you or others while doing their rounds... you know what to make out of it. OR perhaps answering cell phone or attending to cell phone while giving lecture, in front of the alter... Seriously, when will they give up?? even beggars in India have cell phones, for crying out loud!
If you are choosing a guru from Brahma-Chaitanya Sampradaya, they must be eager to performing Harinama Sankirtana (at least once a week) although many gurus will disagree with me on this. Some say that one of the 9 methods is sufficient Sravanam, Kirtanam, Smaranam,..... Atma nivedanam.
Guru must be sought from one of the four bonafide Sampradaya.
Bogus Yogis and yogis pretending to be God, like Nityananda (Tamilnadu), and Kalki Bhagavan (A.P) must be avoided at all cost.
I can't understand why some people take shelter of Brahmachari dress to impress mataji's , If sex desire is there better to confess it to family members or seniors in temple and better to marry rather than doing act like common karmi people who hanker after woman. It spoils ISKCON's good name and standard, They should not expect themselves to call them as Prabhuji's it's ridiculous simply. Marriage is not an offence and one of the approved Ashram in Vedic culture BUT the question is why use ISKCON's money/image to satisfy personal sense gratification . It is nothing but pretending . When desire for sex is there why supress it . Isn't it better to marry at perfect age under the guidance of parents and guru rather than marry at 40/50 breaking Brahmacharya and spoils Iskcon name. This is utter non-sense.
If hankering for girl is there why not lead a karmi life like hogs and dogs and run after girl rather than taking shelter in Srila Prabhupada's Iskcon and spoils the environment.
There is no ideal person in this world, because of that even being brahmachari does not mean that person is ideal. Wearing saffron means one is informing opposite sex not to disturb him. It is some kind of a protection.
It does not mean that he is already liberated soul.
Krishna says in Bhagavad Gita that even a sannyasi will have such like desires but liberated is that who takes shelter of Krishna and controls his senses in those moments of lusty attacks. Not that who becomes pride and weakens his senses.
In this way desires will be there but one should control his senses.
In the other side the whole society should try to help them to protect their celibacy. For example, if girls wear properly, act properly ...it is their respect to them and are helping to them not disturbing them in their renunciation, isn't it?!
Your servant,
It is true that Brahmacharya life means to control the senses, as we are not liberated soul But some facts hurts when people make a show of practicing brahmacharya but eventually falls down with woman at their later age which gives a very bad image to ISKCON particulalrly in India where people have high respect for saffron and has concept they will never fall down, This kind of circumstances also shakes the faith of the new comers in Krishna consciousness.
The thing is if one is seeing inside that he is pretending the world by making a show of Brahmacharya intentionally then isn't it better to enter in Grihastha ashrama rather than having relation with mataji's . It makes havoc impression in SP's mission.
Society will never be conducive for practicing celibates, even situation will become worse eventually, we can't go to every lady and say please madam don't wear this kind of dress, rather a Brahmachari has to work out it himself with the help of strong association Now even after than one intentionally keep contact with mataji's Then why should Iskcon feed them ?
Your aspiring Servant
Hari Bol
yes, true,
Your servant,
please accept my humble obeisances! All glories to Srila Prabhupada!
If a brahmachari completes his education of brahmachari life he then should where white and nearly for one travel or do pilgrimage. As i heard from the lecture of HH Bhakti Vidya Purna Swami Maharaj.
If he was told by his mother to get married than it is ok. But he has to inform about it by wearing white. But not do it with hidden acts.
To get married after brahmachari life is a normal thing. Only few will be able to remain as a naishtika brahmacharis plus if they are always under the lotus feet of sincere Devotees. Without association such like life is not recommended.
Definitely such like thing should be informed to the authorities but in not critical mood but just understanding normal situation. Or else first talk with that brahmachari himself and inquire him if he has intention to get married and take responsibility of a girl and family. Better if it is done by the parents of a girl.
But before knowing everything girl should not associate with him in a secluded place like giving number or sitting in rikshaw and going somewhere. Better if they like each other, and if his intention is to get married then they should do engagement and inform the society that their intention is to get married and in that situation no one will criticize them.
The authorities should be informed because we have to protect the big family ISKCON which Srila Prabhupada and his disciples created it with hard works. Big family which does what he says, does not cheat and from whom others would get shelter.
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For example, i heard one incident which thought proper to say it now.
There was one brahmachari in saffron, but before entering into brahmachari ashram he had a girl friend whom he left. Then after 5-6 years of Temple life he remembered her and sent to her just a single message asking if she remembers her and that he still loves her. But that message somehow or other came to the phone of a senior brahmachari who was in charge of others. The next morning senior brahmachari called him and politely explained that for him brahmachari life is finished. It is not proper that he has to wear white. So he did.
It was in the very strict Temple.
Because of that there are marriage bureaus in every big Temple congregation. It is created just to help young Devotees to find a suitable partner not disturbing each other at the Temple programs...
Your servant,
Hare Krishna dear Devotees, please accept my humble obeisances! All glories to Srila Prabhupada!
Krishna says in Bhagavad Gita that millions will search for absolute but among them only few find. And among those who found the absolute only one will achieve perfection.
In this way many people may come to Krishna Consciousness and chant the Holy Names but only few will achieve love for Krishna in this life. Others who do it externally, without sincerity will be benefited accordingly.
In this way we do not have power to correct others but we have power to pray and help to them rather than criticizing them.
Some Devotees will have weakness of heart because of that they will not follow proper Vaishnava etiquette. And Krishna will take care of that. If needed He will will punish him or her and make him/her understand that he/she has done mistake. Because he/she is dear to Krishna.
But we can correct ourselves and show examples to others.
It is true brahmachari in saffron should not associate with matajis except the situations when it is needed for service. Even grihastha should not talk with other women in the absence of his wife or other people.
These rules are only meant for our own better progress. If we do not be strict we will go slow but if we take it seriously we will go fast.
And in order to follow these rules strictly one should be engaged in the service full time. Proper chanting and good association will help to control the senses. But if criticize them then such like weakness will appear in us.
Beg forgiveness if something is wrong!
Your servant,
THE BONA FIDE DEVOTEES OF LORD KRISHNA.
http://www.iskcondesiretree.net/group/krishnaconsciousness/forum/to...
RESPECT FOR THE AUTHORIZED DEVOTEES.
http://www.iskcondesiretree.net/group/krishnaconsciousness/forum/to...
THE SINCERE DEVOTEES OF LORD KRISHNA.
http://www.iskcondesiretree.net/group/krishnaconsciousness/forum/to...
Q. WHO IS A SIKSA GURU ?
http://www.iskcondesiretree.net/group/krishnaconsciousness/forum/to...
Q. WHO IS THE CAITYA GURU ?
http://www.iskcondesiretree.net/group/krishnaconsciousness/forum/to...
Q. WHO IS A JAGAD GURU ?
http://www.iskcondesiretree.net/group/krishnaconsciousness/forum/to...
Q. WHO IS A DIKSA GURU ?
http://www.iskcondesiretree.net/group/krishnaconsciousness/forum/to...
IMPORTANT INSTRUCTIONS ON INITIATION.
http://www.iskcondesiretree.net/group/krishnaconsciousness/forum/to...
Hare Krsna dear ashwani pr
pamho
there are different standards for initiations, some people get initiated without purifying themselves much.Also initiation is not a big thing, it is a formal connection with parampara- that does not mean a person is a very advanced devotee. any one can take vows and take initiation after qualifying but that does not mean they will go back to Godhead. initiation is just a step to go ahead, if the person still commits sinful activities and thinks that he will nullify them by chanting, he commits 7th offense and it is extremely dangerous. Actual thing is responsibility from heart that now onwards, strictly the vows have to be followed.
But by chance fall down takes place then Krsna considers them and forgives as Aniruddha pr has said. Also , the examples that you have said, lots of people come with ulterior motives and many people come without getting much purified. Also if a person is in saffron clothes , he must maintain the sanctity of that cloth.
Regarding association of prbhus with matajis and vice versa, there are standards that are followed by all temples. we cannot force people to follow the strictest of standards. The regulative principles have to be followed strictly and also if someone is breaking them, then we should inform the authorities. But we have to make sure that if someone is in a responsible position then he follows standards else we should complain.
ys
Sad to know if wrong people are getting initiation..
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