Hare krishna... Does the form in the spiritual world of a living entity remains fixed.. Like if someone is a grass in spiritual world, he would eternally remain a grass and serve Krishna or can one change from grass to becoming friend or elephant or relative to serve Krishna ... It is said that variety is the mother of enjoyment... How do we understand this?
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I found this link . Sp has given proper reasons. Doesn' seem like a divine trick
http://www.krishna.com/where-do-fallen-souls-fall
That' ok my friend. This is just a discussion . We are here to help each other just like you helped me know many things.Thanks once again for that. Who fell from where and how wont have any impact on our kc. I end up saying Sp philosophy is the best ! I have no doubt on that
Actually, Srila Gour Govinda Swami has told many times that letters are not necessarily siddhanta. In the jiva issue, for example, certain devotees were using Srila Prabhupada's letters as evidence, and Srila Gour Govinda Swami boldly said that one cannot always quote from letters. Letters are written according to time, place and circumstance, and according to the qualification of the disciple to whom the letter was written. Gurumaharaja asked us, "Can you show me from Bhagavatam where it is stated that jivas fall down from Goloka Vrindavan? "Similarly, can you quote any siddhanta saying "don't go for Sadhu-sanga?"
Another interesting thing about the jiva Issue: In 1995, in Sridham Mayapur, when the GBC voted on the origin of the jiva, out of a twenty-three-man committee of big leaders, 18 voted by raising their hands, that "we fall," and five voted that "we didn't fall." When my Gurumaharaj went to speak siddhanta, they told him there was no need, since they had already voted on it. After the meeting, in his room, he was very unhappy with their behavior. He told us " What is this? Now they are voting on siddhanta. They are simply husking the husk. Whereforth does jiva come? I am quoting Sri Jiva Goswami, Sri Viswanatha Chakravarty Thakura and Sri Bhaktivinoda Thakura. These are not my words. But you see the situation now.They are voting on siddhanta." Previously he had told about a dog who was walking down the street. Ten people voted that the dog was a goat. Does that mean the dog has become a goat simply because ten people have voted? Similarly, whatever we say must be confirmed by Sadhu, Guru and Sastra.
Vaisnavas are not interested in the opinion of many conditioned souls. They are only interested in the one Absolute Truth.
Sp started iskcon on orders of his guru. He didnot have any personall motive. That is why even after having heartattack twice he still continued to fulfill the desires of his guru. This i have heard from devotees. I told you sp might have got more enlightened. If sp has no right to reject then either the matter put by you is changed or the one put by me is changed. I have heard that iskcon books are also changed. In the conversation given there are two other occasions where a person loses his intelligence and touches fire. Once when he commits suicide by setting himself ablaze and second by deliberately punishing himself as we see in movies. So we surely can fall from goloka!!
Prabhu since both of us believe in same philosophy there's no need for any debate
I don' see much difference between Srila Bhaktivinod Thakura and Sp but massive contrast in Sridhara Maharaj. If sp did some divine trick then why did the above two great maharaj speak totally different?? What i think is disciples in disciplic sucession became more enlightened. I am not demeaning anyone. For e.x. drona was awesome. He gave his disciples all the knowledge but only pandavas were good and amogst pandavas arjuna did advanced studies and proved to be better than him. Someone said here that cm had predicted about sp so certainly sp is the best with due respect to other greats.
As much as I remember sp this dhruvaloka is not vishnu lok. It is a top most planet built for dhruva which won' be destroyed at the time of annhilation. Secondly 3.15.27 says jay vijay were standing outside the 7th gate of vaikunta. This means they were in vaikunta and not standing outside . Ok May be I erred in case of jay vijay as "they fell" but most comments cant be taken directly on face value like krishna says we won' come back to material world once we goto vaikunthaloka as we have seen that there is a sloka in sb which promotes overindulgence in lust as a remedy to get out but actually there was much more indepth meaning.
Ok thanks
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