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Hare Krishna to all Matajis, Prabhujis & Devotees

There are so many devotees on ISKCON DESIRE TREE who are very new and even old also on ISKCON DESIRE TREE,  who actually are not aware of the Importance of Guru in Krishna Consciousness so kindly all Vaishnav and Dr. Devotees kindly put the light on the importance of Guru in Krishna Consciousness.

Hare Krishna

Your Humble Servant

Bhuwan Dutt Bawari 

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What you said is true, but it does not mean that any person who just picks up Bhagavatam and reads it once has reached the transcendental world. In order to understand the true devotional spirit of the book Bhagavatam, we need to take shelter of the person Bhagavatam (a pure devotee). It is impossible otherwise to even obtain liberation from material bondage what to speak of entering the transcendental world.

Dean Prabhu: You highlighted in bold the following phrases from SB 12.13.11-12  "give ecstasy to the saintly devotees and demigods".

But can you think of one saintly devotee mentioned in Srimad Bhagavatam who did not accept a guru and became perfect on their own by their own efforts? If these highly intelligent people from previous yugas themselves, had to seek shelter of a devotee then how can we deny the need for a spiritual  preceptor? 

The other verses you quoted do not refute the need for accepting a Spiritual master. 

Hare Krsna Pr

What you have said is exactly true. In these forums there are many types of people. Not all of them have same conclusion as vaishnav acaryas like Srila prabhupad. No need to listen to them. Srila prabhupad clearly in his books states one needs to take shelter of devotee of Krsna and understand truth from them by rendering service

There are many people who call themselves, prabhupadanugas, ritviks etc etc. They profess that no need of spiritual master, just chant and read etc. Prabhupad is only guru etc. All these people are simply themselves misled and trying hard to mislead others. A serious practitioner must avoid such pretenders and take shelter of genuine preachers of KC who are servants of Srila Prabhupad and parampara.

YAS Bharat

Hare Krsna

If that's what Vaishnav acaryas had thought, there wouldn't have been anyone of us in these forums. If there is talk about srimad bhagavatam anywhere it is due to kind compassion of Srila Prabhupad and other vaishnav acaryas. Without such person bhagavatams living entities suffer in material world.

The view of vaishnav acaryas in line of lord chaitanya is not to see universe as useless, but to see it as opportunity to take conditioned souls back to godhead. If one has no gratitude to such vaishnavas preaching the glories of bhagavatam and holy name, it is sad.

Hare Krsna

Hare Krsna

Srila Prabhupad ki Jay !

Hare Krsna

Dean Prabhu: I have previously refuted your arguement based on SB 1.1.2, where you highlighted in bold the phrase :is sufficient in itself for God realization. Yes Bhagavtam is sufficient, but we must take shelter of all the verses in it, not just pick and choose whatever we want.

SB 11.3.21

tasmad gurum prapadyeta

jijnasuh sreya uttamam

sabde pare ca nishnatam

brahmany upasamasrayam

Translation:

Therefore any person who seriously desires real happiness must seek a bona fide spiritual master and take shelter of him by initiation. The qualification of the bona fide guru is that he has realized the conclusions of the scriptures by deliberation and is able to convince others of these conclusions. Such great personalities, who have taken shelter of the Supreme Godhead, leaving aside all material considerations, should be understood to be bona fide spiritual masters.

So if you truly claim to be a follower/worshipper/devotee of only Srimad Bhagavatam and nothing else, then accept the above verse also, which is in Bhagavatam. If you ignore this verse then your claim is whimsical and a figment of your imagination.

Hare Krsna Bharat Pr,

Thank you for your nice and encouraging reply. I feels good to receive support when we are trying to make a point. You are right, some people cannot be convinced no matter what, that is why the only thing left to do, is to continuously and relentlessly refute their baseless, whimsical arguments, so that they do not mislead sincere devotees. 

That is what I have been trying to do, I have previously given counter arguments to everything Dean Prabhu brought up, and this thread became dormant, but suddenly somebody comments and it becomes active again and he brings up the same old points once more? What logic is this? Therefore, the only recourse I see is to keep untiringly attacking their claims, so that they may not corrupt the views of the sincere seekers. 

Hare Krsna

Thats true. If one is logical and open minded it makes sense to discuss. 

Here it is like

We say Guru is required.

Someone says Bhagavatam is important.

We say Thats great but that doesn't say if Guru is required or not

Someone says Bhagavatam is good

We say Bhagavatam is great but it must be heard from guru

Someone says Bhagavatam is ecstatic

We say - This is a thread about importance of guru. If you are not acknowledging importance of guru, then you are saying guru is not important. Lets talk when you gather the guts to say it explicitly.

Haribol

Dean Prabhu: Yeah, but point out one "real devotee" who did not accept a spiritual master? On one hand you say Bhagavatam is: transcendental  nectar flowing from the lips of  sri shukadeva goswami. But you ignore the verses that underline the importance of guru and the need for accpeting one, like

SB 11.3.21:

Translation:

Therefore any person who seriously desires real happiness must seek a bona fide spiritual master and take shelter of him by initiation. The qualification of the bona fide guru is that he has realized the conclusions of the scriptures by deliberation and is able to convince others of these conclusions. Such great personalities, who have taken shelter of the Supreme Godhead, leaving aside all material considerations, should be understood to be bona fide spiritual masters.

Hare Krsna

Do u accept all purports given by Srila prabhupad unto Bhagavad Gita, Srimad Bhagavatam(and other vaishnav scriptures) equivalent to Bhagavatam or god ? Yes or NO

Hare Krsna

The Spiritual Master is non-different from the Lord and He is the Lord in flesh and blood!!

Read this article for more enlightenment..

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