Hare Krishna ,
All Glories To Srila Prabhupada ,
What is Devi - Bhagwatam ?
I have heard that it is a Upurana , but it contains 18000 verses .
It itself declares it as Mahapuran . But there is a controversy over its authentication .
Some says it was written by Ved Vyas . Some says it was written in Bengali ,
It is a major text Of Shaktas , and Glorifies Durga .
But there are many questions regarding Durga's daughter being Laxmi and Saraswati .
Is it a Purana or It have been designated Bhagwatam by people .
Like we have Bhagwat Puran , So it is called Srimad Bhagwatam .
How can devi-puran be Devi Bhagwatam and Durga be the mother of Laxmi and Saraswati .
Hari Bol !!
Replies
Hare Krishna Prabhuji
I agree I have no knowledge of vedas/puranas as you have but I don't understand how did I or Sharanagat prabhuji ( i have read his messages)has done any offense against Vaishnava or against supreme God.
No one becomes vaishnava or Lord Krishna's devotee in one shot , like a lottery system. Everybody goes through phases of questioning/doubting and eventually they realize the truth.
But even those who are taking the first step into KC with questions and doubts are also considered a devotee of Lord .
So please be considerate to them and answer them patiently and without showing any aggression. That's what I want to convey through this discussion.
Hare Krishna
Hare Krishna Alka Mataji. Dandavat Pranam. All glories to Srila Prabhupada
Mataji have you seen the number of post in this thread? if you read all the post from first you must have look how the devotees tried to give answer of the same question again again with patience. If some one in knowledge saying something and quoting from shastras but still we are not in a mood to accept and beating the drum again and again till it breaks then concluding something may seems aggressive but it is reasonable.It is like someone is saying 2+2=4, but we are not ready to accept while we don't know addition.
DEVI BHAGATAM is something where there are text which is offending Krishna seriously. I have posted the content also, please go through all the post if you have doubt. The word aggression can be applied in those cases where someone is forcefully trying to suppress one without showing any evidence and conviction, but when devotees are claming something with firm conviction and evidence from shastras then they are not aggression rather they are trying to let the questioner know what is what.
Mataji please try to understand, when we say something not being from the transcendental platform then those opinion are not considered authentic and final beacuse we have four defect
1. our senses are imperfect
2. we have cheating propensity
3. wo do mistakes
4. we are illusioned
BUT SHASTRAS ARE FREE FROM ALL THOSE ABOVE DEFECTS. SO WHEN DEVOTEES ARE QUOTING FROM SHASTRAS AND ACHARYA"S WORK THEN ONE SHOULD ACCEPT THEM RATHER THAN CONTRADICTING. WITHOUT SURRENDER AND SERVICE NO SPIRITUAL PROGRESS CAN BE DONE , QUESTION CAN BE ASKED BUT NOT WITH ARGUMENTATIVE MOOD.
There is no question of what I think, I believe , it has no value whwn come to spiritual knowledge rather what scripture says we have to accept.
Your aspiring servant
Hari bol
Hare Krsna Dwaipayan Prabhu, Hari Bol!
Your words are inpiring. Let me finish Devi Bhagwatam as well. I am here in search of the path. I will read what you suggested as well.
Your servant,
Sharanagat
Hari Bol Prabhu Ashwini Kumar jee.
My conversation with Sudipta Prabhu led me to read verses of Devi Puran. Reading it, I can tell that there is no conflict between two Purans - Srimad Bhagwat and Devi Puran. VedVyasa has put both in perspective.
Hari Bol!
Your servant,
Sharanagat
Further attempt to distort the image of Lord Krishna and compare him with others will led me to report abuse of you to the moderator of this forum. This is Vaishnava forum and not Shakta
Hare Krsna Sudipta Prabhu! Please go ahead, if that makes you feel better. Never I said Non Vaishnana, nor I spoke without quoting sources. NEVER in my life, I ever said mayawadi to anyone.
:-)
I did not digress, nor I am flammer. No reason to fear for me. The topic is something else and you pulled somewhere else. Nor I said you are not a Vaishnava nor was I disrespectful to anyone here. (never to Srila Prabhupada and NEVER EVER to Supreme Godhead). When you calm down, you may want to revisit.
Hari Bol!
Your servant,
Sharanagat
The Puranas Have Three Divisions: sattvika (mode of goodness), rajasika (mode of passion), and tamasika (mode of ignorance) as described below in the Brahma Vaivarta Purana itself:
vaishnavam naradiyam ca tatha bhagavatam subham
garudan ca tatha padmam varaham subhadarsane
sattvikani puranani vijneyani manisibhih
brahmy andam brahmavaivarttam markandeyam tathaiva ca
bhavisyam vamanam brahmam rajasani nibodhata
matsyam kaurmam tatha laiogam saivam skandam tathaiva ca
agneyanca syadetani tamasani nibhodhata
O you of perfect vision! The self-realized sages have determined that there are three divisions of the eighteen Puranas corresponding to the modes of goodness, passion, and ignorance. The Vishnu, Naradiya, Bhagavata, Garuda, Padma and Varaha Puranas are in the mode of goodness. The Brahmanda, Brahma-vaivarta, Markandeya, Bhavisya, Vamana, and Brahma Puranas are in the mode of passion. The six Puranas in the mode of ignorance, are Skandha, Matsya, Kurma, Lioga, Siva, and Agni.
sattvikesu ca kalpesu mahatmyamadhikam hareh
rajasesu ca mahatmyamadhikam brahmano viduh
tad-vadagnesca mahatmyam tamasesu sivasya ca
saokirnesu sarasvatyah pitrnansca nigadyate
The Puranas in the mode of goodness glorify the Supreme Lord, Shri Krishna; those in the mode of passion promote the glories of Lord Brahma, the creator of the universe; and those in the mode of ignorance celebrate the greatness of Agni, Siva, and Durga. In addition many other scriptures have different mixtures of goodness, passion, and ignorance, and promote the worship of demigods like Sarasvati and Laksmi along with worship of ancestors, and many other lower religious processes.(Tattva-Sandarbha, annucheda 17)
So you can see from the above list of Puranas, that Devi Purana is not even one of the 18 principal Puranas so it cannot be compared with the supremely pure Shrimad Bhagavata Purana as the Shrimad Bhagavata Purana directly glorifies the Supreme Lord in the mode of shuddha sattva i.e. pure goodness. Though Shrimad Bhagavata and Devi Bhagavata may be similar in some parts still the Devi Bhagavata is for the worshipers the mode of ignorance (tamo guna) whereas Shrimad Bhagavata is for those who want to directly transcend the three material modes of nature and hear the pure pastimes of the transcendental Lord.
Your Servant.
Hari Bol!
Hari Bol Prabhu jee Hari Bol!
My answer will surely provoke you, unless you decide to see the blade of the the grass. :-)
Does it mean that Sri Hari is not gunatita, if Puran is Satva? And because Devi Purana is not in list, and because it is said MahaPurana by Ved Vyasa, can we take argument of Shaktas as truth that only Devi is gunatita?
Prabhu jee - Bhakti does not mean looking at other's puran. It means looking at glory you have. If you accept father and mother in one form, please do so. No reason to point out in other form as derogatory. Ekam Satyam Satyam, baudha Vipra Vadanti.
Hari Bol!
Your servant,
Sharanagat
Hare Krishna. PAMHO. AGTSP.
Everything in this material world is under modes of material nature except God. If God has a guna then He is under Maya and then Maya becomes God. But thats not TRUE. The Visnu incarnation, although master of the modes of goodness within each universe, is in no way in touch with the influence of material nature. You have said that Durga Devi is gunaless because her purana is not mentioned above. But think carefully, Lord Shiva is the husband of Durga Devi and if his purana is in the mode of ignorance what mode would Durga Devi's purana be in? Probably lower than ignorance. There are probably other puranas glorifying other demigods and if they are not in the above list then that doesn't make that demigod gunaless and grater than God. The above are the main 18 puranas Vyasadeva wrote. All other puranas are lower than those. Impersonalists cant make good arguments so don't use their arguments here. So i beg you to stop offending Krishna anymore. And the father is Krishna but the mother is Radharani NOT Durgaa Devi. The above post I made are the from the basis of the words of Jiva Gosvami. It's totally up to you who you think says the truth: Great Acharyas- Jiva Gosvami- Vaisnavas OR impersonalists(Shaktas).
Padma Purana 6.236.7
mayavadam asac chastram pracchannam bauddham uchyate
mayaiva kalpitam devi kalau brahmana rupina
"Mayavada or Advaita philosophy is an impious, wicked belief and against all the conclusions of the Vedas. It is only covered Buddhism. My dear Parvati, in Kali-Yoga I assume the form of a brahmana (Adi Shankara) and teach this imagined philosophy.
Padma Purana 6.236.8-9
apartham sruti-vakyanam darsayan loka-garhitam
sva-karma-rupam tyajya tvam atraiva pratipadyate
sarva-karma paribhrastair vaidharma tvam tad ucyate
paresa-jiva-paraikyam maya tu pratipadyate
"This mayavada advaita philosophy preached by me (in form of Adi Shankara) deprives the words of the holy texts of their actual meaning and thus it is condemned in the world. It recommends the renunciation of one's own duties, since those who have fallen from their duties say that the giving up of duties is religiosity. In this way, I have also falsely propounded the identity of the Supreme Lord and the individual soul."
Padma Purana 6.236.10
brahmanas caparam rupam nirgunam vaksyate maya
sarva-svam jagato py asya mohanartham kalu yuge
"In order to bewilder the atheists, in Kali-yuga, I describe the Supreme Personality of Godhead Lord Gauranga Krishna to be without any form and without qualities."
Padma Purana 6.236.11
vedante tu maha-sastrera mayavadam avaidikam
mayaiva vaksyate devi jagatam nasha-karanat
"Similarly, in explaning Vedanta mahashastra, I described the same non-scriptural and inauspicious mayavada philosophy in order to mislead the entire population toward atheism by denying the personal form of my beloved Lord."
You Servant.
Hari Bol!
Dear Sharangat jee............
YOU ARE JUST CROSSING THE LIMIT, WHY YOU ARE DELUDING THE BHAKTAS HERE BY TAKING SHELTER OF MAYAVADA AND SHAKTAS AND PROMOTING YOURSELF AS VAISHNAVA
HERE IS THE TEXT FROM DEVI BHAGAVATAM WHICH IS A INSULT TO KRISHNA
THE FIFTH BOOK
Chapter I – On the superiority of Rudra over Visnu
It is She that created from Her Ownself the eight Nâikâs (the leading mistresses) and also sixteen thousand and fifty women for the pleasure and enjoyment of Krisna Bhagwân, the incarnation of Ananta (Visnu Bhagavân); thus Krisna Bhagavân was made completely subservient to them just like a perfect slave. When a young woman, though she is alone, can bind a man down by the network of Mâyâ, like strong iron chain, what wonder is there that the sixteen thousand and fifty women would make Krisna play in their hands like a S’uka bird and make him an instrument to serve any purpose that they liked.
"KRISHNA AS PERFECT SLAVE".................................I just can't imagine what kind of scripture it is and what would be the followers of this.................THIS IS A SHAKTA TEXT . Why are you comparing it WITH THE Jewel BHAGAVATAM??????????
I can give 100 as such offensive example from Devi -Bhagavatam. Please don't try to distort the image of Krishna by masking as a PSEUDO VAISHNAVA
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