Hare Krishna,Prabhuji/Mataji,I want to ask that why followers of Rama tries to make Lord Rama the original supreme personality of godhead through which Even Lord Krishna came from lord rama(amsavatar).....?
How many RAMAYANA ARE THERE IN THIS WORLD FROM CREATION OF THIS MATERIAL WORLD/UNIVERSE/COSMIC?
Why RAMAYANA IS ALSO CALLED AS THE Veda avatar?
Is there was ramayana before Valmiki muni wrote "Shrimad Valmiki RAMAYANA"?
How we can stabalize that Rama and Krishna is same?and who is the source of whom?Since Rama devotees are also there who also give evidences from vedas,upanishad,purana,agama,samhitaetc....?
Thank you in Advance :) :) :) :)
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सीतानाथ समारम्भां रामानन्दार्य मध्यमाम्।
अस्मदाचार्य पर्यन्तां वन्दे श्रीगुरू परम्पराम् ।।
Srī Rāma is the one who appears on earth as an Avatār of Śrī Hāri Vīshnu and some times he comes directly from Saket. When Śrī Hāri Vīshnu takes Śrī Rāma Avatār than his companions are Lakshmāna (Anānt Shësh Nāag), Bharata (Sudãrshan Chakrā) and Shātrughna (Shānkh).
But when Paratpar Par-Brahmā the lord who resides in Sāket appears than the chronology is different, than,
(Nārad Panchratra Brihād Brahmā Samhitā)
Śrī Bhārat who is lord of Vāikuntha, Śrī Lakshmān who resides in Sheer Sagar (क्षीर सागर) and Śrī Shātrughna who is swayam Bhumā Purushā, all of them incarnated with him to serve Śrī Rāma.
Around same question was also asked by Śrī Hanumān ji in Kishkindha Kand,
Your beautiful, soft limbs are the destroyer of the mind and you are enduring the sorrowful sun and wind of the forest. Are you one of the three gods or are you both Nara and Narayana.
Again in next doha
Or else You are the Lord Himself (of Sāket), the root cause of the world and the master of all the planets, who incarnated in human form to take people across the ocean of material existence and to destroy the burden of the earth.
And Śrī Rāma is the Eternal husband of Srímati Sitā Maharani and appears as a son of King Dashārath and Queen Kaushālya.
Here are few virtues of Śrī Rāma,
(Valmiki Ramayan 2-1-9)
"In his Rupa, Lavanya, Saundarya (beauty, elegance and charm etc), Śrī Rāma is incomparable, He is a hero of valor and without envy (towards anyone). By virtues, he was like Maharaj Dasarātha. In this way, Śrī Rāma was verily an incomparable son on the earth."
(Valmiki Ramayan 2-1-10)
That Rāma is always peaceful in mind and speaks softly and sweetly (does not speak harsh or rude words even in laughs). He does not react to the hard words spoken by others.
(Valmiki Ramayan 2-1-11)
That Rama, because of his good bent of mind, feels glad even by whatever way a good or little thing is done to him. He does not remember any number of bad things or offenses done to him.
Śrī Rāma does not think or remember any number of faults or mistakes or bad things done to him by others, he is the sweetest Lord.
(Valmiki Ramayan 2-1-31)
"Even enraged gods as well as demons could not contain or defeat Shri Rama in the battle*. Shri Rama is free from jealousy. He is conquered anger. He has no arrogance and envy. He had not humiliated any living being. Kaala (time) could not control him, He remains always same in his own transcendental virtues (free from anger, envy, undefeated, soft and sweet spoken, always righteous, noble, gentle etc) and qualities (ever Youthful, attractive and charming etc)."
*This is also indicated in Śrīmad Rāmcharit Mānas,
Śrī Hanumān said; O Ravaña, I swear that even thousands of Vishnu and thousands of Shankar cannot protect the one who is enemy of Śrī Rāma.
(Valmiki Ramayan 2-1-28)
For Vihar-Kreeda-Prayojana (disporting and delighting during Vihaar-kreeda), Shri Rama knows the arts of Music, and dance. He also knows painting, playing the instruments, etc. He knows how to distribute the wealth. He is efficient in riding and taming of elephants and horses etc.
(vālmīki rāmāyaṇa 2.2.35)
Shri Rama is best in the world in the arts of music and dance.
Maharshi Vālmiki says in Śrī Rāmāyaṇa, Śrī Rāma is the Kāma-vardhanah (means mere a sight of whom infuses love towards him in everyone, not in just women, but even among men, from animals even to ordinary creepers- plants-trees and rivers, all feel a strong attraction and love towards him in Shringaar i.e. romance, such Kaam- vardhanah he is). That's Rāmcharit Mānas says Kāam Köti Chhābi Syām Sarirā, One doesn't need to chant a separate Kāma-mantra for Śrī Rāma, as the name 'Rāma' itself means the one who is foremost among all those who delight others (rāmō ramayatām śrēṣṭhaḥ) [Śrīmad Vālmīki Rāmāyaṇa 2.53.1]; 'Rāma' means the one who gives bliss; And bliss (ananda) is the most subtle and essence of all. Śrī Rāma is the only one in whole cosmos who can delight (give bliss to) 'Śrī Ji (Sītā Ji), none else.
In Valmiki Ramayana, the story of Śrī Rāma starts from the time when he is around 13 years old. Valmiki intentionally skipped initial 12 years of leela of Bhagavan Śrī Rāma in greater good of society, which is predominantly his dev-leela, unrestrained display of his complete divinity. (Just like Ved-Vyasa skipped childhood pastimes of Śrī Krishna in Mahabharata, yet His initial 12 years Madhurya pastimes in Vrindavan is disclosed in Bhagavatam only.) Similarly, childhood-leela of Śrī Rāma is revealed in many Ramayana-s mainly Śrīmad Bhüshundí Ramayan, Satyopakhyan etc, He does many divine- pastimes in the villages of many divine forests on the bank of river Sarayu. Before his marriage, he did many divine-pastimes, He did many Rāsa dance with many Gop-kanya-s (gopi-s), deva-kanyas, Gandharva-Kanya-s etc on the bank of river Sarayu. He was the one who did Rāsa-dance first time in Vrindāvan on bank of River Yamuna, this was the reason when BrahmA appears in Yuddha-Kanda before him after the elimination of Ravana, He eulogized Śrī Rāma as the one who is worshiped by Gopika-s in Vrindavan in Adhyatm-Ramayana.
As this servent quoted earlier that Śrī Rāma is both Avatari and Avatar and their is no difference between them. But in Śrī Samprāday Śrī Rāma is worshipped as an Avatāri from whom everything has emerged out like Brahmā, Vishnu even Maha Vishnu, Shiva, Krishna, Narsimha etc.
Atharvavedā Shrüti Vedsaropanishad
Whose Ansh are Brahma Visnu and Mahesvara, Whose divine Guna is Mahavisnu, The only one who is the cause of all causes, The one who is higher than the highest, such is Śrī Rāma, the son of Dasratha. (Approx same shloka is also found in Vashisht Samhita Ch. 26 and Samved Sudarshan Samhita 1–5.)
As Śrī Rāma himself says;
(श्रीमद्रामायणे वाल्मीकीये अद्भुतोत्तरकाण्डे भगवद्धनूमत्संवादो नाम चतुर्दशः सर्गः)
The Lord of the infinite worlds, who is inseparable Nāräyan, is my supreme form and maintains the universe.
Vīshnu, Narayan, Krishna, Narsimha, Varah etc all other Gods and Demi Gods are only the manifestation Śrī Rāma and Śrī Rāma is Paratpar.
(Yajurvedā Shrüti RāmRahāshyopanishād)
In all the scriptures like Vedās, the supreme principle is 'Tāraka Rāma' in the form of Brāhman. Śrī Rāma is the Supreme Brāhman. Śrī Rāma is the supreme form. Śrī Rāma is the Supreme Being. Śrī Rāma is Tarakabrahma. Hanumān Ji preached to the devotee of Śrī Hāri Vīshnu and other Rishis "I myself, Śrī Ganēshā, Goddess Saraswati, Goddess Durgā, All the Guardian (Khetra Pāl), Sun (Suryā), Moon, Lord Śrī Hāri Nāräyana, Lord Naräsimha, Lord Vāsudev (Śrī Krishnā), Lord Vāraha etc. all are the mere parts of Lord Śrī Rāma. Lakshmāna, Shātrughna, Bharata, Vibhishana, Sugriva, Angad, Jambavant and Pranav (Om ॐ) are also mere parts of Lord Śrī Rāma.
Śrī Rāma and his manifestations are also mentioned in Śrīmad Vālmiki Rāmayan in Yuddh Kanda in Sarg 117 as said,
'You are Lord Narayana, the omnipotent lord who holds the wheel, the earth-bearer with a beard and the conqueror of past and future enemies of the deities.
Here Brahmā ji is worshipping Śrī Rāma as Visheshya and with Visheshan he equalize Sri Rama with Śrī Hāri Nāräyana, Krishnā. He is telling that O Śrī Rāma you incarnates as Nāräyan who hold chakra, you incarnated as Krishnā and so on.
As said in various other scriptures same as Vedas,
(Shiv Samhita 5 Patal)
The two-armed Janakivallabh shri ram you are always everywhere. By the will of your devotee, you take 4 handed narayan form in vaikunth.
(Satyopakhyan)
Two armed Shri Raghunandan is the supreme Brahman, supreme abode and is the cause of jagat who rests on bed of serpent.
(Valmiki Ramayan 7.104.9)
Kaal says:- After my prayers, in the beginning of creation, you forsaken your durdharssa form(form that is difficult to be achieved by so me many) the bhava (2 armed Shri Ram) and assumed the form of Vishnu for the sake of protection and sustenance of all living beings.
Why Visheshya and Visheshan?
As said futher their,
You are the supreme religion of the people. You are Vishvaksena Chaturbhuja. (Vishwaksena, is the commander-in-chief of the army of the Vishnu, additionally serving as a gatekeeper and chamberlain of celestial abode Vaikuntha.)
Now tell me have you seen Śrī Rāma gatekeepering Vāikuntha and fighting in favour of Devatas with four arms?
Not at all, all these Visheshan are been used to show Omnipresence of Śrī Rāma that it's only Śrī Raghunandan who manifests an Nāräyana, Vīshnu, Krishna, Vāraha, Vishvaksena etc.
Infact Śrī Raghavā is,
(Narad Panchratra Vashistha Samhita)
The one who is beyond Śrī Hāri Nāräyana, who is beyond even Śrī Krishnā, who is the most Paratammamvarat Paramatma, that is Dashrath's son Raghavā. Whose lotus feet are served by Brahma ādi Tridev (Shri Shiva and Shri Vishnu) and Matsya etc, is the reason for many incarnations. Hail to you such Supreme Lord Śrī Raghunandan.
(Nārad Panchratra Śrī Bhardwaj Samhita)
Śrī Hāri Nārāyana is an incarnation of Śrī Rāma and shines in Vaikunth in the form of four arms with conch, chakra and mace. There are many incarnations of Śrī Rāma differentiating by Kalas, Part, Vibhuti etc. But Śrī Rāma himself is Par-Brahma who is devoid of Maya in his two armed form (human form)
(Śrī Valmiki Rāmāyaṇa 2.44.15/16)
"Oh, Kausalya! Rama is the sun of even sun (the illuminator of even sun), He is the fire of even fire, he is the Narayan (prabhu*) of the Narayan (*here the word prabhu denotes narayan not Devatas, as devata are already mentioned in next shloka) ,(Śrimati Sītā is) the Sri of Śrī i.e. the Goddess of even Śrī-devi (Lakshmi), the foremost glory of glory, the forbearance of forbearance, the Devata of all Devata, and the foremost being (i.e. the Supreme-being) among all the beings. Indeed, what misfortune could be ever there for such Rama whether he lives in the forest or city?
Shrimad Valmiki Ramayana is the most authoritative scripture in Vishishtadvaita- Vaishnavism, Brahma himself told 'there is no grain of untruth in it'. When Śrī Rām killed Ravana, then Lord Brahma came and did Stuti of Śrī Rām. He eulogized Shri Ram in various ways, BrahmA mentions Narayana, Krishna, Varaha, Hrishikesa, Vishnu etc as various forms of Shri Rama.
Count...
Srímati Sitā Maharani is has also been depicted as Lakshmi as Śrī Lakshmï is an incarnation of Śrī Sītā,
(VR- 6.117.28)
O Śrī Rām, Maa Sītā is Goddess Lakshmi (the divine consort of Lord Vishnu), while You are Lord Visnu. You are Lord Krishna.
As also said in Śrīmad Rāmcharit Mānas,
From whose fraction the innumerable mines of virtues Lakshmi, Parvati and Brahmani (powers of the trinity) are produced and by whose brow the world is created, The same (Swarupa-Shakti of the Lord) Sita is situated on the left side of Rama.
Here one should not get confused with these Visheshan applying for Śrī SitāRāmā. Again telling here Brahmā ji is worshipping Śrī Rāma as Visheshya by using Visheshan for them.
As Maa Lakshmi is non other than Incarnation of Srímati Sitā Maharani as mentioned in Vedās,
Śrī Sītā has been depicted as the Original form of all Shakti in Vedās as shown below,
Athârvavedā Shrüti Sītā Upänīshad
Śrī Sītā is threefold through Her power, namely the power of desire, the power of action, and the power of knowledge. Taking the incarnation of Śrī Devi, Bhudevi, Neeladevi, the one who benefits everyone with her influence, shines in the form of moon, sun and fire.
That's why in Śrīmad Vālmiki Rāmayan which is itself Incarnation of Vedās clearly says that Śrī Sītā is even Śrī of Bhagwāti Śrī.
Same is said by Brahmānd Purān,
In short, Śrī Sītā manifests herself in three form Śrī, Bhu and Nila. By Śrī she becomes Rukmini by Bhu she becomes Satyabhama and by Nila she becomes Radha Rani Sarkār who is worshipped in all Lokas.
Gosvami Tulsidasa who is the incarnation of sage Vālmīki (-Bhavishyottar Purāṇa), says same thing in Śrī Rāmacharitmānas, that Śrī Rāma is like billions of Lord Vishṇu, infinite billions of Maa Durgā and billions of Lord Shiva.
(ŚrīRāmacaritamānasa 7.92.3/5)
Śrī Rāma's body possesses the charm of a myriad Cupids. He is as inexorable in crushing the enemy as countless millions of Durgās. He enjoys the luxury of a myriad Indra-s and is immeasurable in expanse as a myriad firmaments. He is as sharp as countless millions of Saraswatis-s and possesses the creative skill of a myriad Brahmā-s. Again, He is as good a preserver as billions of Vishṇu-s and as thorough a destroyer as billions of Rudra-s.
Incomparable as Śrī Rāma is, He has no compeer. Śrī Rāma alone is Śrī Rāma's peer - so declare the Vedas - even as the sun really suffers diminution by being likened to a myriad glow-worms.
And so Śrī Krishnā also a manifestation of Śrī Rāma,
(Atharvavedā Shrüti Krishnōpanishad 1.1)
That Śrī Rāma, who transformed himself (incarnated) as Krishnā, attained Sarvaatmakta (सार्वभौमिकता) by his very lilā (divine exploits, pastimes); and thus deities-sages-masses were completely satisfied on this earth. I make prostration before that same Śrī Rāma.
Not only Śrī Rāma but his Mantra/ Name is also Paratpār as said by Vedas,
(Atharvavedā Shrüti Rama uttartapini 5.6-7)
Among all the mantras of Lord Ganesha, Lord Shiva, Goddess Durga, Lord Surya and in all vaishnav mantra, the mantras dedicated to Shri Rama bestow greater fruits. And This Mantra-Raja of Bhagavan Shri Rama easily bestows Billions and Billions times the fruits of all the mantras dedicated to Lord Ganesha, Shiva, Durga, Surya and Vishnu. Such is the supreme glory of Mantra - Raj !
'Rāma' this is a whole indivisible term, from Ram-dhātu in the sense of 'ramate sarveshu' - 'the one who dwells in all sentients and insentient (chid-achid) substances, is existing in them, is pervading them' - the meaning of 'all- pervading' Vishnu' and 'Antaryāmī vāsudev' both these meanings are included. Thus, the name 'Rāma' is as comprehensive (and pervading) as the names Viṣṇu, Vasudeva and Nārāyaṇa (narāṇām ayanam), however both the names Vāsudeva (Vāsu + Dev) and Nārāyana (Nāram + Ayanam) consist of two words, therefore by the divine-name 'Rāma', one whole undivided indivisible Brahman (the supreme absolute) is rightly and perfectly specified!
As said in Pulatsya Samhita,
Srímati savitri with Śrī Brahma, mata lakshmi with Śrī Hāri Nāräyana, Śrī Shambhu with Maa Parvati constantly chants “Ram”.
As cleared by Srímad Goswami Tulsidas ji Maharaj in Rāmcharit Mānas that,
How far can I praise the name, even Rām cannot sing the virtues of his name.
This chaupāai is exact translation of Vashistha Tantra,
The strength of the name of Sri Raghavā has been cleared more in Vashistha Tantra;
Those who are ready to chant the name of Shri Ram and are the ones who think about the meaning of the name. All the three worlds are purified by their lotus feet. There are as many names of Lord Vishnu like Lord Krishna, Narayan etc. So after chanting these names for thousands of Births one get love in the name Rām. Only one Shri Ram knows the fruits of his name in his heart but cannot say it. Because the Glory of his name is very big even his can't say that what to talk about Brahma and all.
(śrīrāmacaritamānasa bālakānda, dohā 256)
"The supreme sacred Mantra (the seed mantra Raam), indeed, is very small, although it has under its sway Brahm, Hari, Hara and all other gods. A tiny goad governs the mightiest and most furious elephant."
Śrī Ayōdhyā-Puri (Sāketa-Loka) is the original source of all Vaikuntha, where the Brahm in his own original form of Śrī Rāma is present with Śrī Śrī Sītā Jī.
(Atharvavedā Shrüti Ram Rahashya Upnishad Uttarkhañd)
Ayodhya, which is beyond nature, true form, Brahmamayi, is also the foundation of all the Vaikunth worlds. Rivers like Virja emerge in its north. And Shri Sitaram ji's place of residence is always present in the Kosh (Mandap) decorated with divine gems.
In Padma puran it been clearly mentioned that Mathura etc Puris are servent of Śrī Ayodhyā Ji,
(Padma Puran)
Mathura etc. all Purias are maidservants of Śrī Ayodhyā Puri. These Puris serve Ayodhyā ji with servility on both the occasions of doomsday and creation.
(Shiv Shita 5 Patal)
AyodhyaPati Śrī Rāma is the lord of the lords of Mathura and other Puri's as their lords are portions of Śrī Rāma.
Bhargav Puran khand 3 Ch. 2
In sort, Śrī Ayodhyā Maharani is the Origin of 5 kinds of Vāikuntha as stated above, around same shloka is found in Vedas also,
(Shukla Yajurveda Mandal Brahmanopanishad 1.1)
Pachch Param Vyom [Chidakash] is called Pachch Vaikunth, its master is Shri Ram who is Tarak Brahmakhya Rajyogaik Siddhi Swaroop.
So from here it is clear that Naam, Guna, lila, Dham of Śrī Rāma can't be matched with anyone.
Śrī Rāma is the most superior than anyone but as all are the manifestation of this sweetest lord that's why no body can't be down grade. As Sri Rama himself present in their heart. He is above all I repeat He is above all. No one can Match Śrī Rāma, Srimad Bhagavad Mahapuran and Vedas has clearly mentioned,
(Śrīmad Bhagwat Mahapurana 9.11.20)
In short, Parikshit! There is no one like Lord Shri Raghuvar, then how can anyone be greater than him.
Hail to Priya Pritam Sarkar ❤️
Hail to Ānand Bhāshyakār Śrīmad Jagādgurü Ramānandacharya 🚩
Read about Lord Ramacandra from original source :
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Haridasa namacarya said :
"All living entities in creation are inspired by the Lord in the heart to act in different ways. People of different religions praise the Lord's holy names and qualities according to the view of their scriptures. The Supreme Lord accepts everyone's mood. If anyone shows malice towards another's religion he actually shows malice to the Lord Himself, who is worshiped by that religion. Since God is one, that person becomes envious of the same Supreme Lord that he himself is worshiping."