hare krishna , all glories to srila prabhpada
we are a eternal servant of krishna as we all know. it is said that in bhagavad gita that not only we have forgotten our real identity as a servent of krishna bt also our eternal relationship wd krishna, and that is swarup. it is also said that by chanting we cn elevate to that platform and attain what is called warup siddhi. it means that we already hv perticular relation such as friend. father, mother lover etc. bt by chanting hw wiil we knw that ohhhh i hv this this type of relation wd krishn? could srila rupa goswami knew about his own identity as a RUPAMANJIRI in a spiritual world. DID PRABHUPADA EVER MENTIONED HIS IDENTITY IN SPIRITUAL WORLD AS A GOPIS ORFRIENDS OR ANYTHING ELSE?
contradictory we hv been told that we cn love krishna in any one of the relations, then is it not contrdicory to already existing eternal ralation , swarup siddhi?
i m asking this just to clear the doubts of myself and all others.
plz forgive if i made any mistake at the lotus feet of all devotees?
hare krishna hari bol
Replies
hare krishna.
does it mean we should not ask question? ofcourse we hv to follow bhakti such chanting etc. and bhagvad gita also allow argument bt not in spirit of challenge bt in sprit of understanding? if i m wrong forfive me
Some devotee of ISKCON once said, Prabhupada had sakhya bhav.
Here is another purport by Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura of the verse which I have cited from Bramha Samhita-
yam krodha-kama-sahaja-pranayadi-bhiti-
vatsalya-moha-guru-gaurava-sevya-bhavaih
sancintya tasya sadrsim tanum apur ete
govindam adi-purusam tam aham bhajami
TRANSLATION
I adore the primeval Lord Govinda, the meditators of whom, by meditating upon Him under the sway of wrath, amorous passion, natural friendly love, fear, parental affection, delusion, reverence and willing service, attain to bodily forms befitting the nature of their contemplation.
Svayam Bhagavän Sri Krishna is the only actual bestower of results;
He bestows the appropriate fruits upon all. The results bestowed
by others are perishable, but the fruit bestowed by Sri Krishna is
never subject to destruction. Bhagavän is eternal, His devotees
are eternal, and His bhakti and the fruit of bhakti are also eternal.
Because pure devotees are full of deep attachment for Him,
they are infinitely superior to the desireless yogés. That Prabhu
who bestows even upon His most antagonistic enemies a result
that is supremely difficult for great yogés to attain must necessarily,
according to the logic of “inferential partial illustration”
(kaimutika-nyäya), bestow the highest fruit of all upon His
devotees who incessantly cultivate favorable activities and
moods in His service. This is certainly not a point of controversy.
What intelligent person could possibly give up such a highly generous
Prabhu as Sri Krishna to worship any other demigod or
demigoddess? Having stated this in the previous verse, Brahmäjé
completes the section characterized by the phrase, “I worship the
original personality, Çré Govindadeva,” with this verse beginning
yaà krodha-käma.
Words such as krodha indicate fear and enmity, as well as
anger. For example, when Bhagavän Sri Krishna enemies such as
Kamsa and Shishupäla become absorbed in Him, even through
moods that are unfavorable to bhakti, He bestows upon them
a transcendental destination. Aho! Pütanä was a man-eating
demoness, accustomed to killing babies and drinking their
blood, yet the most liberal and merciful Sri Krishna gave her a
destination befitting a nurse-maid in Goloka because she had
assumed the appearance of a mother. Våñabhäsura and Keçédaitya
also attained destinations like the oxen that pull carts in
Goloka Vraja.Sri Krishna also awarded a destination to the wicked
Käléya-näga in Goloka Vraja, using him as a boat in His waterpastimes.
Although many other avatäras of Bhagavän are
bestowers of elevated destinations upon their enemies, they
have given the demons killed by them destinations such as heavenly
happiness and vast sensory enjoyment. However, they have
not given destinations extending even up to the point of liberation,
what to speak of elevation to Goloka.
Anger is the mood of an enemy. Natural intimacy is the mood
of a friend. Lust refers to sringära, the amorous mood, which is
the sweetest of all. The affection of a mother and father for their
child is called vätsalya. Reverence like that offered to one’s guru
is neutrality (çänta-bhäva). Servitude indicates däsya-bhäva.
Here the word moha implies the utter forgetfulness experienced
due to a vision of Brahman; this is the brahmamaya-bhäva of the
proponents of impersonal knowledge.
The purport of saying that those who contemplate Bhagavän
attain bodies corresponding to their moods is that by becoming
absorbed in these moods at the time of sädhana, when they
achieve perfection, they attain bodies like the associates of
Bhagavän according to their individual bhävas, and they become
absorbed in His service. Those who become absorbed in the
transcendental subject through the mood of anger attain only a
partial aspect of that transcendence in the form of impersonal liberation
(säyujya-mukti). Aside from that, those who have the
sentiments of çänta, däsya, sakhya, vätsalya and sringära attain
bodies appropriate for those individual bhävas, with beauty and
qualities corresponding to the extent of their attainment. In this
regard, we find evidence in the statement of Sri Vasudeva
(Srimad-Bhägavatam 10.3.41): “adåñöänyatamaà loke çélaudäryaguëaiù
– in my previous life I begged from You the benediction
of having a son endowed with all qualities like You. However,
You said, ‘There is no one else endowed with qualities like Me.
It can never be. Therefore I will personally appear as your son.’”
From this it is concluded that no living entity can have all the
transcendental qualities of Bhagavän. Thus the words sadåçéà
tanum indicate that one can attain a body suitable for an associate
of Bhagavän, which is partially imbued with His transcendental
qualities.
It has also been stated in Brahma-sütra: “jagad vyäpäravarjam
– it is not possible for the jévas to perform the task of
creation, maintenance and destruction of the universe. It is only
possible for Brahman. This ability of Bhagavän cannot possibly
occur in the jéva.” Çré Närada has also stated (Çrémad-
Bhägavatam 1.6.29): “prayujyamäne mayi täà çuddhäà
bhagavatéà tanum – when my devotional service was mature,
Bhagavän mercifully bestowed upon me my pure body as His
associate. My previous body composed of the five gross material
elements was cast aside and I went to the abode of Bhagavän in
that transcendental body.” The essence of this statement is that
no one is identical with Bhagavän in all respects and no one can
become so at any time.
In Çrémad-Bhägavatam (11.5.48) we find: “vaireëa yaà
nåpatayaù – if kings such as Çiçupäla and Dantavakra attained
Bhagavän by the mood of enmity, then anurakta-dhiyäà punaù
kim – what will be unattainable for the unalloyed premibhaktas
through their powerful attachment for Him? What need
is there to say that they most definitely attain Him?”
One can attain Çré Kåñëa by being absorbed in anger, hostility
or envy, or also through the moods of shänta, däsya, sakhya,
vätsalya and sringära. However, just as there is a difference
between hostility and loving attachment, there is also a difference
in the destinations attained through these respective
moods. The sädhakas attain the positions of being different types
of associates in accordance with the level of their prema or
anuräga (deep attachment). The highest attainment is only
achieved by those with the highest loving attachment. On the
basis of this principle, it is established that there is no difference
between the associates situated in Goloka and the associates
who descend to Bhauma-Våndävana. The two are non-different.
This is also mentioned in Çrémad-Bhägavatam: “nandädayas tu
taà dåñtvä – the Vrajaväsés headed by Çré Nanda saw the majesty
of Goloka in Brahma-hrada and became joyfully amazed.” The
oneness of Goloka and Bhauma-Våndävana has been established
by this statement.
TÄTPARYA
Bhakti is of two kinds: regulative (vaidhé) and spontaneous
(rägänugä). The first type of bhakti is based on the faith that
arises to a small extent through the medium of çästra and the
instructions of one’s guru, and it develops very slowly because
of the confinement of observing the rules and regulations of
scripture. That bhakti is transformed into niñöhä, ruci, äsakti and
bhäva by the cultivation of activities in connection with Çré Kåñëa
in the form of hearing, chanting and remembering in the association
of sädhus. When bhäva arises, the sädhaka-bhakta can be
the recipient of Çré Kåñëa’s mercy. In this process there is a long
delay before arriving at the stage of bhäva. This is called vaidhébhakti.
Rägätmikä-bhakti gives results very quickly and attracts Çré
Kåñëa, and therefore it is superior. What is its inherent nature?
This particular verse describes the various forms in which it is
perceived. The category of rägätmikä-bhakti includes passive or
neutral adoration (çänta-bhäva) characterized by guru-gaurava
(reverence); däsya-bhäva exemplified by sevya-bhäva (servitude);
sakhya-bhäva (friendship) typified by sahaja-praëaya (natural
intimacy); vätsalya-bhäva (parental affection); and mädhuryabhäva
(amorous love) characterized by käma. Anger (krodha),
fear (bhaya) and delusion (moha), although spontaneous, are
not included in the category of bhakti. Anger is seen in demons
like Çiçupäla, fear in demons like Kaàsa and delusion in the
scholars of Mäyäväda philosophy. Although there is absorption
in the spontaneous activities of anger, fear and the total forgetfulness
of everything arising from the internal vision of the
impersonal Brahman, they are still not considered to be bhakti,
because they are not favorable to Çré Kåñëa.
Furthermore, when we consider çänta, däsya, sakhya, vätsalya
and mädhurya, spontaneous attachment (räga) remains almost
absent from çänta-bhäva because of an excess of neutrality.
Nevertheless, it has been accepted as bhakti because it is somewhat
favorable. Besides this, the other four moods possess an
abundance of spontaneous attachment. According to Bhagavadgétä
(4.11): “ye yathä mäà prapadyante täàs tathaiva bhajämy
aham – I reciprocate with everyone according to their individual
degree of surrender to Me.” Those who cultivate attachment in
the form of anger, fear and delusion attain salvation in the form
of säyujya-mukti, the impersonal aspect of liberation in which
one imagines that he has merged with Brahman. By santa-bhäva
one attains a body suitable for remaining absorbed in Brahman
and Paramätmä, like the four Kumäras, headed by Sanaka and
Sanätana, or like Çukadeva Gosvämé. By däsya and sakhyabhäva
one attains an appropriate male or female form in accordance
with one’s eligibility. By vätsalya-bhäva one acquires a
fatherly or motherly form corresponding to one’s mode of service.
A pure, transcendental body of a gopé is attained by those in
sringära-bhäva.
Realizing one's siddha-deha is the highest stage of reality for the liberated souls who have entered the world of prema-bhakti. Only the imitationists' process for attaining siddha-pranali is false. One should therefore show interest and study this subject in great detail under the guidance of pure devotees who are themselves free from material contamination, tendencies toward exploitation, and self-deception.The path of raganuga-bhakti is in fact the process leading to one'ssiddha-deha, either as a braja gopi (kamanuga ) or as a devotee insakhya, vatsalya, or dasya rasa (sambandhanuga ). Contemplation of one's siddha-deha, however, requires realization. It is not within the capacity of the conditioned mind. Unless the necessary adhikara is achieved, attempting to contemplate one's siddha-deha will only cause confusion. This is confirmed in Bhaktivinoda Thakura's Bhajana-rahasya as follows:
adhikara na labhiya siddhadeha bhave
viparyaya buddhi janme saktira abhave
"If one thinks of their siddha-deha without achieving the adhikara (necessary realization), their intelligence gets bewildered."
Upon acquiring the necessary adhikara, the internal sadhana of raganuga-bhakti begins. Srimad-Bhagavatam (11.21.2) states further:
sve sve 'dhikare ya nistha
sa gunah parikirtah
viparyayas tu disah syad
ubhayor esa niscayah
Piety and impiety are ascertained thus: Applying oneself steadily (chanting the Holy Name) in accordance with one's level of advancement is actual piety, whereas deviation from one's position (imitating a stage that one has not attained) is considered impiety.
Sufficient lobha or eagerness must awaken within the sadhaka to begin the inner culture ofraganuga. In the meantime, we should follow the vaidhi-bhakti outlined in Bhakti-rasamrta-sindhuwith emphasis on chanting the Holy Name. Regarding lila kirtana, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura states in Prakrta-rasa-sata-dusini,
anartha thakara kale rusa-guna kore na
"While still contaminated by anarthas, one should never sing songs about the Lord's confidential pastimes." The symptom of eagerness (lobha ) is freedom from lust. When lobha arises, thesadhaka has the necessary adhikara to enter into raganuga-sadhana proper. At that time,anarthas or impediments from past karma may still be present. One may still be affected by sleep, hunger, thirst, and so on, yet eagerness for material life (lust) will be gone. We cannot be eager for love of Krsna and love of the opposite sex at the same time. Rupa Goswami explains that inraganuga-bhakti one must follow all of the vaidhi until lobha awakens. This certainly includes hearing about the vraja gopis, but this must be done properly. When one's heart has become cleansed from lust and intense eagerness for vraja prema is aroused, one is qualified to hear about the vraja gopis and to perform the internal raganuga-sadhana.
vikriditam vraia-vadhubhir idam ca visnoh
sraddhanvito 'nusrnuyad atha varnayed yah
bhaktirm param bhagavati pratilabhya kamam
hrd-rogam agv apahinoty acirena dhirah
One who, following in the footsteps of the previous acaryas, faithfully hears from a qualified Vaishnava about the transcendental pastimes of Krsna and thegopis, in time becomes sense controlled and freed from lust and attains pure devotional service. (SB.10.33.39)
The qualifications for pure devotional service are not cheap. The siddha-pranali imitators twist thissloka and so many other slokas to suit their purpose. The so-called gurus who encourage their followers to jump immediately to hearing about the intimate affairs of Radha and Krsna are not following the spirit of this verse. They are not nivrtta tarsair (free from lust) as Sukadeva Goswami was. Sukadeva Goswami properly administered the bhavausadhi (medicine of Krsna katha) to Maharaja Pariksit after first discussing the nine other cantos of the Bhagavat.
"Piety and impiety are ascertained thus: Applying oneself steadily (chanting the Holy Name) in accordance with one's level of advancement is actual piety, whereas deviation from one's position (imitating a stage that one has not attained) is considered impiety." Srimad Bhagavatam (11.21.2)
To attain the stage of pure devotional service, first one must have some faith or sraddha. Sraddhahas been described by Srila Bhakti Raksaka Sridhara Deva Goswami as the halo of Srimati Radharani. Only Radharani can reveal Krsna to the devotee and her good will appears in the fortunate living entities as sraddha. That sraddha will lead one to associate with pure devotees,sadhu-sanga. In the association of pure devotees, one will hear the Holy Name of Krsna and holy talks about Krsna. Gradually, one will come to inquire about how to make spiritual advancement and render devotional service. That is the stage of bhajana-kriya. In bhajana-kriya, initiation ordiksa is offered to the devotee who has taken shelter under the lotus feet of the spiritual master. By the acceptance of diksa, the devotee is given proper acquaintance with the goal of Krsna consciousness and he or she is sent in the direction of krsna-lila. Diksa may be of two kinds depending on the qualification of the disciple. In Sri Chaitanya's lila, so many qualified persons were present. The kind of initiation they received brings with it the immediate experience of thesiddha-deha. We are not qualified for this, neither are the so-called siddha pranali gurus capable of giving it.
After receiving diksa, the devotee begins the process of developing a spiritual body or siddha-deha. At that time, the knowledge and services required for advancement are given to the disciple by the guru. This is followed by siksa or further instructions, and the disciple simply has to carry out those instructions according to the directives given by the six Goswamis.
Next comes the stage of anartha nivrtti, the clearing of unwanted things from the core of the devotee's heart. This means purification. Then nistha, firm faith, develops, at which time the devotee is not easily shaken from the path. A devotee in the stage of nistha becomes steady in devotional service and does not waste time, especially in idle talks or in matters that do not concern Krsna. Then comes the stage of ruci or a sweet taste for hearing the transcendental glories of the Supreme Lord, his name, his abode, his devotees, and his lila. When ruci increases,asaktih or attachment to the object of one's bhajana develops. From asaktih, the sadhakaprogresses to bhava-bhakti, the awakening of transcendental emotions of love. These emotions when mature are called prema. They are the feelings that constitute the spiritual body of a liberated devotee. Realizing this spiritual body is also called svarupa-siddhi.
Once the devotee has reached the stage of svarupa-siddhi in madhurya-rasa, further instruction is given from Sri Gurudeva and the devotee realizes her to be a representative of Srimati Radharani. At that time all the details about the devotee's eternal form and service are revealed. To want to know these things in a premature stage of devotion is a material desire. Such knowledge certainly comes to a devotee in due course, but it is never the desire of a pure devotee to want to know such things prematurely.
A realized devotee who gives up bodily connection with this material world is immediately transferred to Gokula Vrndavana within the universe where Krsna has manifest his lila. There, in the company of the eternal associates of the divine couple, the devotee receives a spiritual body corresponding to his or her rasa. When the Lord manifests his lila in another universe, the devotee is transferred to the portion of lila that always remains unmanifest, Goloka Vrndavana. This is known as vastu-siddhi. This is explained in the Brahma-samhita purports of Bhaktivinoda Thakura, texts two and fifty-five.
As long as one still has a material body, one should receive direction from Rupa, Sanatana, and Raghunatha dasa while serving and taking shelter of a bona fide spiritual master who knows the science of Krsna consciousness. Our success is assured if we follow the process in this way. But if we want the cheaper method, we are lost.
Our parampara is not in want of anything, as wrongly conceived by the imitators and some castegoswamis. Raghunatha dasa Goswami has given everything, and our guru has carefully handed that to us. The divine service of Srimati Radharani is the highest aspiration within the infinite lila of Krsna. Radha-kunda is the highest place of service. By our guru's grace, we will take our place at Govardhana Hill, the place of our eternal residence. Sri Guru has given us the aspiration to join the highest group of Srimati Radharani's servitors under the shelter of Lalita devi and Rupa Manjari, and he has given us the hope that one day we will be accepted into the group of Sri Chaitanya's most intimate associates. The imitators, misunderstanding all these things, are now barren of the most valuable opportunity in this human form of life.
Our humble position is to go on uttering Krsna-nama and rendering pure devotional service at the lotus feet of our spiritual master, free from exploitation and renunciation, in the association of like-minded pure devotees. That is our eternal spiritual identity and our highest aspiration.-Narasingha Maharaj.
This is so deep ocean that a person like me floating on the surface cannot dare to comment.But this gives one the thrill none the less.Thanks
Hare Krishna!!! We have two kinds of bodies, sadhaka deha and the siddha deha. With sadhaka deha, one chants and propagates Krishna consciousness, with the siddha deha, he associates with Krishna in the spiritual world. However, in the conditioned state the spiritual body lies dormant. As you chant, your heart gets cleansed and you understand your your spiritual relationship with Krishna and you can actually have a vision if your spiritual body. Now, in spiritual world tou have a body according to your bhav. This is confirmed in Bramha Samhita:
yam krodha-kama-sahaja-pranayadi-bhiti-
vatsalya-moha-guru-gaurava-sevya-bhavaih
sancintya tasya sadrsim tanum apur ete
govindam adi-purusam tam aham bhajami
TRANSLATION
I adore the primeval Lord Govinda, the meditators of whom, by meditating upon Him under the sway of wrath, amorous passion, natural friendly love, fear, parental affection, delusion, reverence and willing service, attain to bodily forms befitting the nature of their contemplation.
PURPORT
Devotion is of two kinds, viz., (1) of the nature of deference to regulation and (2) constituted of natural feeling. Bhakti is roused by following with a tinge of faith in the rule of the sastras and instruction of the preceptors. Such bhakti is of the nature of loyalty to the scriptural regulations. It continues to be operative as long as the corresponding natural feeling is not roused. If a person loves Krsna out of natural tendency. there is the principle of raga, which is no other than a strong desire to serve, which turns into bhava or substantive feeling. When the substantive feeling is aroused the devotee becomes an object of mercy of Krsna. It takes much time to attain this stage. Devotion which is of the nature of feeling is superior to that connected with scriptural regulation, soon attains to the realized state and is attractive to Krsna. Its various aspects are described in this sloka. Santa-bhava, full of reverence to superior, dasya-bhava, full of service for carrying out the commands of the object of worship, sakhya-bhava or natural friendly love, vatsalya-bhava or parental affection and madhura-bhava or amorous love, are all included in the category of devotion of the nature of instinctive attachment. But anger, fear and delusion, though they are of the nature of instinctive impulse, are not devotion in the strict sense of the term, because they are not friendly but hostile to the object. Anger is found in asuras like Sisupala, fear in Kamsa, and delusion in the panditas of the pantheistic school. They have the feelings of anger, fear and instinctive impulse marked by complete self-forgetful identification with the nondifferentiated Brahman. But as there is no friendly feeling towards the object of devotion there is no bhakti. Again among the feelings of santa, dasya, sakhya, vatsalya and madhura--santa, though indifferent and dormant in raga, is still reckoned as bhakti on account of its being a little friendly. There is an immense volume of raga in the other four varieties of emotion. By the promise of Gita, ye yatha mam prapadyante tams tathaiva bhajamy aham ("I serve one according to his submission"), those, who allow themselves to be actuated by the sentiments of fear, anger and delusion, attain to sayujya-mukti (merging in the Absolute). The santas obtain bodily forms with aptitude for addiction to Brahman and Paramatma. The dasya and sakhya classes of worshipers attain bodily forms characterized by masculine or feminine disposition according to their respective grades of eligibility. The vatsalya class of worshipers get bodily forms befitting fatherly and motherly sentiments. The amorous lovers of Krsna attain the pure forms of gopis (spiritual milkmaids of Vraja).
Since Rupa Goswami had manjari bhav, he saw his spiritual body as Rupa Manjari.