Hare Krishna!!Dandwat pranam to alli have a doubt that when we describe Golokdham we say "yadgatva na nivartante taddham paramam mam"(from Bhagwadgita) means place from where no one fall down to jad jagat.on the other side, we say as we are originally from Golokdham and because we want to enjoy separately therefore we are here.
if we belongs to Golokdham then why we are here?
plz clear this.
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Any pastime conducted by the Supreme Personality of Godhead is an arrangement by yogamāyā, not mahāmāyā. Therefore it is to be understood that when Jaya and Vijaya descended to this material world, they came because there was something to be done for the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Otherwise it is a fact that no one falls from Vaikuṇṭha.
The bodies of the inhabitants of Vaikuṇṭha are completely spiritual, having nothing to do with the material body, senses or life air. Therefore, kindly explain how associates of the Personality of Godhead were cursed to descend in material bodies like ordinary persons.
This very significant question would be difficult for an ordinary person to answer, but Nārada Muni, being an authority, could answer it. Therefore Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira inquired from him, saying, etad ākhyātum arhasi: "only you can explain the reason." From authoritative sources it can be discerned that associates of Lord Viṣṇu who descend from Vaikuṇṭha do not actually fall. They come with the purpose of fulfilling the desire of the Lord, and their descent to this material world is comparable to that of the Lord. The Lord comes to this material world through the agency of His internal potency, and similarly, when a devotee or associate of the Lord descends to this material world, he does so through the action of the spiritual energy. Any pastime conducted by the Supreme Personality of Godhead is an arrangement by yogamāyā, not mahāmāyā. Therefore it is to be understood that when Jaya and Vijaya descended to this material world, they came because there was something to be done for the Supreme Personality of Godhead.Otherwise it is a fact that no one falls from Vaikuṇṭha.
Of course, a living entity who desires sāyujya-mukti remains in Kṛṣṇa's Brahman effulgence, which is dependent on Kṛṣṇa's body (brahmaṇo hi pratiṣṭhāham (BG 14.27)). Such an impersonalist who takes shelter of the Brahman effulgence must surely fall down. This is stated in the śāstra (SB 10.2.32):
"O Lord, the intelligence of those who think themselves liberated but who have no devotion is impure. Even though they rise to the highest point of liberation by dint of severe penances and austerities, they are sure to fall down again into material existence, for they do not take shelter at Your lotus feet." The impersonalists cannot reach the Vaikuṇṭha planets to become associates of the Lord, and therefore, according to their desires, Kṛṣṇa gives them sāyujya-mukti. However, since sāyujya-mukti is partial mukti, they must fall again to this material world. When it is said that the individual soul falls from Brahmaloka, this applies to the impersonalist.
From authoritative sources it is learned that Jaya and Vijaya were sent to this material world to fulfill the Lord's desire to fight. The Lord also sometimes wants to fight, but who can fight with the Lord but a very confidential devotee of the Lord? Jaya and Vijaya descended to this world to fulfill the Lord's desire. Therefore in each of their three births—first as Hiraṇyākṣa and Hiraṇyakaśipu, second as Rāvaṇa and Kumbhakarṇa, and third as Śiśupāla and Dantavakra—the Lord personally killed them. In other words, these associates of the Lord, Jaya and Vijaya, descended to the material world to serve the Lord by fulfilling His desire to fight. Otherwise, as Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira says, aśraddheya ivābhāti: the statement that a servant of the Lord could fall from Vaikuṇṭha seems unbelievable. How Jaya and Vijaya came to this material world is explained by Nārada Muni as follows.
Even Vaikunta planets is spiritual and who said it is easy to get?
only sayujya mukti is some what insecure. you may fall back from the that type of mukti.
People once who go back to Godhead they return back only for helping Lord in his leelas...
when Lord says " he does not come back " - He is describing the greatness of his abode - once you go there you need not come back ... like if you want prisoners to reform, you'll tell them "hey you know ... there's a place if you go there you can be free ... you won't have sufferings & you don't have to come back here..." so the statement from the Gita is primarily to attract us to the Kingdom of God - same way how you counsel prisoners .... but the Lord is not a fool ... even if you're in spiritual world & you do something wrong you will come back ( like Jay, Vijay) ... if prisoners break rules again they'll be back to prison ... according to srila prabhupad's writings ... spiritual world is everywhere ... it's more a question of mentality ... you are in spiritual world if you have the right mentality (of following Lord's instructions) ... it's a very subtle point ...
why we "fell" from spiritual world - we shouldn't be concerned with that ( like if you get malaria you won't be concerned with which mosquito bit you & when etc..) ... focus will be on getting cured ==> so focus should be on developing the right mentality & enjoying our eternal life full of bliss & knowledge ( as said by HH Radhanath Maharaj)
This prabhu is a very interesting but incredibly sublime topic....which you have to seek shelter in the sastra to fully appreciate correctly.Srila Prabhupadas veiw is that we are eternal servants of Radha and Krishna,We originally come from the speritual world...our original home,hence back home back to godhead!However the isopanisad give a different answer ,that we fall from the brahmana.....some vaisnavas therefore have a different slant on this subject as a consequence.Actually when i have heard this subject it is explained ,that we momentarily have a desire to enjoy seperately from krishna.Automatically because we are within the spiritual environment we are indeed propelled into the material atmosphere....immediately,powerfully expelled!But this example is merely for the few!Others that are never interested....never venture into the material atmosphere.They are eternally liberated,which is the vast majority of inhabitants of the spiritual realm!So both truths are indeed present!...your servant
Srila Prabhupada has many times stated and it is mentioned in Bhagwad Gita as well that we are Marginal potency of the Lord and being the marginal potency though we have spiritual potency but becasue we are in contact with this material nature i.e. this material world, we are under the influence of material energy. We originally belong to spiritual world it is true but since we wanted to enjoy seperately from Lord and Krsna made the same arrangment in this material world by making perverted arrangment.
Your question is in your answer only. Hope it clarifies. Thanks Hare Krsna
Replies
sohum prabhu hare krishna,
Please read this carefully,
SB 7.1.35, Translation and Purport:
The bodies of the inhabitants of Vaikuṇṭha are completely spiritual, having nothing to do with the material body, senses or life air. Therefore, kindly explain how associates of the Personality of Godhead were cursed to descend in material bodies like ordinary persons.
This very significant question would be difficult for an ordinary person to answer, but Nārada Muni, being an authority, could answer it. Therefore Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira inquired from him, saying, etad ākhyātum arhasi: "only you can explain the reason." From authoritative sources it can be discerned that associates of Lord Viṣṇu who descend from Vaikuṇṭha do not actually fall. They come with the purpose of fulfilling the desire of the Lord, and their descent to this material world is comparable to that of the Lord. The Lord comes to this material world through the agency of His internal potency, and similarly, when a devotee or associate of the Lord descends to this material world, he does so through the action of the spiritual energy. Any pastime conducted by the Supreme Personality of Godhead is an arrangement by yogamāyā, not mahāmāyā. Therefore it is to be understood that when Jaya and Vijaya descended to this material world, they came because there was something to be done for the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Otherwise it is a fact that no one falls from Vaikuṇṭha.
Of course, a living entity who desires sāyujya-mukti remains in Kṛṣṇa's Brahman effulgence, which is dependent on Kṛṣṇa's body (brahmaṇo hi pratiṣṭhāham (BG 14.27)). Such an impersonalist who takes shelter of the Brahman effulgence must surely fall down. This is stated in the śāstra (SB 10.2.32):
ye 'nye 'ravindākṣa vimukta-māninastvayy asta-bhāvād aviśuddha-buddhayaḥāruhya kṛcchreṇa paraṁ padaṁ tataḥpatanty adho 'nādṛta-yuṣmad-aṅghrayaḥ
"O Lord, the intelligence of those who think themselves liberated but who have no devotion is impure. Even though they rise to the highest point of liberation by dint of severe penances and austerities, they are sure to fall down again into material existence, for they do not take shelter at Your lotus feet." The impersonalists cannot reach the Vaikuṇṭha planets to become associates of the Lord, and therefore, according to their desires, Kṛṣṇa gives them sāyujya-mukti. However, since sāyujya-mukti is partial mukti, they must fall again to this material world. When it is said that the individual soul falls from Brahmaloka, this applies to the impersonalist.
From authoritative sources it is learned that Jaya and Vijaya were sent to this material world to fulfill the Lord's desire to fight. The Lord also sometimes wants to fight, but who can fight with the Lord but a very confidential devotee of the Lord? Jaya and Vijaya descended to this world to fulfill the Lord's desire. Therefore in each of their three births—first as Hiraṇyākṣa and Hiraṇyakaśipu, second as Rāvaṇa and Kumbhakarṇa, and third as Śiśupāla and Dantavakra—the Lord personally killed them. In other words, these associates of the Lord, Jaya and Vijaya, descended to the material world to serve the Lord by fulfilling His desire to fight. Otherwise, as Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira says, aśraddheya ivābhāti: the statement that a servant of the Lord could fall from Vaikuṇṭha seems unbelievable. How Jaya and Vijaya came to this material world is explained by Nārada Muni as follows.
Even Vaikunta planets is spiritual and who said it is easy to get?
only sayujya mukti is some what insecure. you may fall back from the that type of mukti.
People once who go back to Godhead they return back only for helping Lord in his leelas...
Hare Krishna.
when Lord says " he does not come back " - He is describing the greatness of his abode - once you go there you need not come back ... like if you want prisoners to reform, you'll tell them "hey you know ... there's a place if you go there you can be free ... you won't have sufferings & you don't have to come back here..." so the statement from the Gita is primarily to attract us to the Kingdom of God - same way how you counsel prisoners .... but the Lord is not a fool ... even if you're in spiritual world & you do something wrong you will come back ( like Jay, Vijay) ... if prisoners break rules again they'll be back to prison ... according to srila prabhupad's writings ... spiritual world is everywhere ... it's more a question of mentality ... you are in spiritual world if you have the right mentality (of following Lord's instructions) ... it's a very subtle point ...
why we "fell" from spiritual world - we shouldn't be concerned with that ( like if you get malaria you won't be concerned with which mosquito bit you & when etc..) ... focus will be on getting cured ==> so focus should be on developing the right mentality & enjoying our eternal life full of bliss & knowledge ( as said by HH Radhanath Maharaj)
AGTSP
Jai Guru Dev
hari Bol Hare Krishna jai Shri Ram _/|\_ _/|\_
Your question is in your answer only. Hope it clarifies. Thanks Hare Krsna