Hare krishna to all,Recently I came across an article which stated that the Srimad Bhagavatam mentioned in the puranas like Matsya Purana, Padma Purana, Agni Purana and others actully refer to Devi Bhagavatam. According to this article Devi Bhagatam fulfills all the characteristics of Bhagavatam mentioned in the Puranas. The person writing this article proves by this that Devi Durga is actually the Supreme.It also states that Gayatri is Devi and not Vishnu.Thus the mention of Gayatri as a characteristic of Bhagavatam it refers to Devi Bhagavatam and not Srimad Bhagavatam.He has given a verse in the article from Taittiriya aryanaka of Yajur Veda(10:23:1) to claim that the Vishwarupa mentioned as a characteristic of Bhagavatam is Ardhanarishwar (Shiva) who is the supreme brahma.One of his most important claims is that the story of Maharaja Parikshit is different in Mahabharata and Bhagavatam. Since Mahabharata is the fifth Veda that is why Bhagavatam cannot be taken as an authority.Whereas Devi Bhagavatam is more similar to Mahabharata.He did not accept the theory of kalpa bheda as Srimad Bhagavatam records the events of the present kalpa as stated in the second canto.He also stated that the detailed mention of Srimad Bhagavatam in the Padma Purana Uttara Khanda is a Vaishnava infiltration. He even says that Madhvacharya and his followers are notorious for distorting the vedas.Thus Padma Purana cannot be taken as an authority.Also Srimad Bhagavatam does not mention the fight between Devi Durga and Mahishasura and also does not mention the puja details of Devi and Radha so Srimad Bhagavatam cannot be taken as an authority. Whereas Devi Bhagavatam is the original Bhagavatam.As far as I know Devi Bhagavatam is an upapurana. But this person says that Devi Bhagavatam is the Mahabhagavatam.I do not agree with this person and I know none of you will agree with him. My question is how can we deal with such claims? If anyone can shed some light it will be of great help.I am sorry if I have offended anyone.
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I have read that post before, it is very very angry and negative. The author basically ignores all the proof against his position and calls it a forgery. It is best to stay away from such people, but if they attack our Sampradaya, we have to answer.
The answer to this dilemma is given in Tattva Sandarbha by Srila Jiva Goswami. Please see the following link:
Basically there are 4 addition qualities of Bhagavatam that is not found in Devi Bhagavatam but in Srimad Bhagavatam.
In addition to this proof, there is also a matter that Srimad Bhagavatam is a sattvic purana (as shown in Padma Purana) and Sattvic Puranas glorify Lord Krsna, not Durga Devi.
All the great acharyas have quoted only Srimad Bhagavatam and never Devi Bhagavatam. Srila Ramanujacharya, Srila Madhavacharya and Srila Sankaracharya all accepted Srimad Bhagavatam not Devi Bhagavatam. Sridhara Swami also commented on Srimad Bhagavatam not Devi Bhagavatam.
As for Kalpa Bheda. Who says Mahabharata records the events on this Kalpa? It is possible the Mahabharata is telling us another Kalpa story and Srimad Bhagavatam is telling us of this one.
As for the question of Padma Purana. Please show him the following verse found in three different Puranas:
The Kurma Purana (2.43.49), Skanda Purana 7.1.2.87-88 and the Matsya Purana(53.68-69) together states as follows:
sāttvikeṣu purāṇeṣu māhātmyamadhikaṃ hareḥ /
rājaseṣu ca māhātmyam adhikaṃ brahmaṇo viduḥ //
tadvadagneśca māhātmyaṃ tāmaseṣu śivasya ca
"In the Puranas in the mode of goodness, the focus is the glories of Lord Hari. Those in the mode of passion, the focus is on the glories of Lord Brahma. Similarly, those in the mode of ignorance, the focus is on the glories of Lord Siva and Agni."
So it is clear that those Puranas in Sattva Guna glorify Lord Hari.
Now, Prakasa samhita (one of the pancharatra samhita) states as follows:
vārāhaṃ vaiṣṇavaṃ pādmaṃ vāyuproktaṃ ca gāruḍam /
śrīmadbhāgavataṃ caiva sātvikānīti hi śrutiḥ // PS_1,4.32 //
“ Varaha ,Vishnu,Padma, Vayu,Garudam and the Srimad bhagavata purana are sattvik puranas.”
“The Aryans declare that Visnu Purana, Bhagavata Purana and Garuda Purana are the best of the Puranas in the mode of goodness."
From this we can conclude that Bhagavata is a Sattvic Purana, and since Sattvic Puranas glorify Lord Hari, Devi Bhagavatam cannot be the Bhagavatam mentioned in these verses.
I hope this helped Prabhuji.
Your Servant,
Mohit Kumar
The Sampradaya Sun - Independent Vaisnava News - Editorials - Srila Jiva Goswami's "Sad Sandarbhas"…
Thank you so much. One more question it is said in the skanda purana that srimad bhagavatam records the events of saraswat kalpa. But bhagavatam records the events of padma kalpa as written in the second canto. What is the difference between the two?
Srimad Bhagavatam took place in the most recent 4 yugas.
Devi Bhagavatam took place several Kalpas ago. We are focused on the most recent, because, what happened many millions of years ago, is not recorded, and definitely far from complete, because most of it is lost over the millions of years.
Vedas cannot be understood by humans. Even Brahma could not understand them. Therefore Brahma prayed to Lord Vishnu to help him understand. They are only meant to be recited, as they Vedas are none different than the Supreme personality of Godhead.
Devi is Maha Maya in the material world and Yoga Maya in the spiritual world.
If one is interested in Devi Bhagavat, they should read one written by Vyasa Deva.
For us Vaishnavas, we stick to Srimad Bhagavatam, so as not to confuse ourselves with what took place millions of years ago. Parikshit pass times, the outcomes are slightly different. So, is the rest. As different things happen differently in different Kalpas. In some Kalpas, Lord took the form of Swan and Peacock!!!
Koena Ghosh > Shravn PrabhuApril 5, 2017 at 7:46pm
I wouldnt waste my time on such people, who are hellbent on distorting facts to prove their path is right. Be that as it may, I will still continue with my devotion and my faith in Krsna, Bhagavad Gita and Srimad Bhagawatam. They are blaspheming our acharyas - Srila Madhvacharya - we are followers of Brahma-Madhva-Gaudiya sampradaya.
Dont bother about them mataji. If anyone asks you these questions, simply direct them to read Bhagawad Gita and Srimad Bhagawatam, as translated and commented by Srila Prabhupada, it will clear their doubts. Its mentioned clearly in SB - krsnastu bhagawan svayam... , aham sarvasya prabhavo, mattah ..... In Devi Bhagawatam or anywhere else, Devi has also shown vishwarupa to prove her claims? Devi has said anywhere I am the supreme, there is no one superior to me? Tell them to give references if that is the case.
There is no dispute among the devis and devatas about who is God, but there is so much dispute among us, followers of them. Its our ego that wants to prove that the one we are following is supreme. The difference in the approach of Srila Prabhupada is - he lets us inquire, convinces us and only then initiates us. All the while we are chanting, getting rid of bad habits and relishing delicious prasadam.
Haribol,
Your servant,
Radha Rasamayi DD
Koena Ghosh > Radha Rasamayi DDMarch 27, 2017 at 4:46pm
Replies
Jaya Nitai! Haribol!
I have read that post before, it is very very angry and negative. The author basically ignores all the proof against his position and calls it a forgery. It is best to stay away from such people, but if they attack our Sampradaya, we have to answer.
The answer to this dilemma is given in Tattva Sandarbha by Srila Jiva Goswami. Please see the following link:
http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/sandarbhas/tattva/sandarbha...
And read the writing and commentary by Srila Jiva Goswami.
Also this link is helpful also as it condenses Jiva Goswamis comments:
here
Basically there are 4 addition qualities of Bhagavatam that is not found in Devi Bhagavatam but in Srimad Bhagavatam.
In addition to this proof, there is also a matter that Srimad Bhagavatam is a sattvic purana (as shown in Padma Purana) and Sattvic Puranas glorify Lord Krsna, not Durga Devi.
All the great acharyas have quoted only Srimad Bhagavatam and never Devi Bhagavatam. Srila Ramanujacharya, Srila Madhavacharya and Srila Sankaracharya all accepted Srimad Bhagavatam not Devi Bhagavatam. Sridhara Swami also commented on Srimad Bhagavatam not Devi Bhagavatam.
As for Kalpa Bheda. Who says Mahabharata records the events on this Kalpa? It is possible the Mahabharata is telling us another Kalpa story and Srimad Bhagavatam is telling us of this one.
As for the question of Padma Purana. Please show him the following verse found in three different Puranas:
The Kurma Purana (2.43.49), Skanda Purana 7.1.2.87-88 and the Matsya Purana(53.68-69) together states as follows:
sāttvikeṣu purāṇeṣu māhātmyamadhikaṃ hareḥ /
rājaseṣu ca māhātmyam adhikaṃ brahmaṇo viduḥ //
tadvadagneśca māhātmyaṃ tāmaseṣu śivasya ca
"In the Puranas in the mode of goodness, the focus is the glories of Lord Hari. Those in the mode of passion, the focus is on the glories of Lord Brahma. Similarly, those in the mode of ignorance, the focus is on the glories of Lord Siva and Agni."
So it is clear that those Puranas in Sattva Guna glorify Lord Hari.
Now, Prakasa samhita (one of the pancharatra samhita) states as follows:
vārāhaṃ vaiṣṇavaṃ pādmaṃ vāyuproktaṃ ca gāruḍam /
śrīmadbhāgavataṃ caiva sātvikānīti hi śrutiḥ // PS_1,4.32 //
“ Varaha ,Vishnu,Padma, Vayu,Garudam and the Srimad bhagavata purana are sattvik puranas.”
The Garuda Purana (3.1.52) confirms:
visnoh puranam bhagavatam puranam sattvottamam garudam cahur aryah
“The Aryans declare that Visnu Purana, Bhagavata Purana and Garuda Purana are the best of the Puranas in the mode of goodness."
From this we can conclude that Bhagavata is a Sattvic Purana, and since Sattvic Puranas glorify Lord Hari, Devi Bhagavatam cannot be the Bhagavatam mentioned in these verses.
I hope this helped Prabhuji.
Your Servant,
Mohit Kumar
As I understand Saraswata Kalpa and Padma Kalpa are both the same. This seems to be what Jiva Goswami says in his Tattva Sandarbha.
Padma Kalpa is equal to Saraswata Kalpa which is equal to Sveta Varaha Kalpa. If you read Srila Prabhupada's commentary to SB 2.10.47.
Srimad Bhagavatam took place in the most recent 4 yugas.
Devi Bhagavatam took place several Kalpas ago. We are focused on the most recent, because, what happened many millions of years ago, is not recorded, and definitely far from complete, because most of it is lost over the millions of years.
Vedas cannot be understood by humans. Even Brahma could not understand them. Therefore Brahma prayed to Lord Vishnu to help him understand. They are only meant to be recited, as they Vedas are none different than the Supreme personality of Godhead.
Devi is Maha Maya in the material world and Yoga Maya in the spiritual world.
If one is interested in Devi Bhagavat, they should read one written by Vyasa Deva.
For us Vaishnavas, we stick to Srimad Bhagavatam, so as not to confuse ourselves with what took place millions of years ago. Parikshit pass times, the outcomes are slightly different. So, is the rest. As different things happen differently in different Kalpas. In some Kalpas, Lord took the form of Swan and Peacock!!!
Hare KRsna Mataji,
PAMHO.
I wouldnt waste my time on such people, who are hellbent on distorting facts to prove their path is right. Be that as it may, I will still continue with my devotion and my faith in Krsna, Bhagavad Gita and Srimad Bhagawatam. They are blaspheming our acharyas - Srila Madhvacharya - we are followers of Brahma-Madhva-Gaudiya sampradaya.
Dont bother about them mataji. If anyone asks you these questions, simply direct them to read Bhagawad Gita and Srimad Bhagawatam, as translated and commented by Srila Prabhupada, it will clear their doubts. Its mentioned clearly in SB - krsnastu bhagawan svayam... , aham sarvasya prabhavo, mattah ..... In Devi Bhagawatam or anywhere else, Devi has also shown vishwarupa to prove her claims? Devi has said anywhere I am the supreme, there is no one superior to me? Tell them to give references if that is the case.
There is no dispute among the devis and devatas about who is God, but there is so much dispute among us, followers of them. Its our ego that wants to prove that the one we are following is supreme. The difference in the approach of Srila Prabhupada is - he lets us inquire, convinces us and only then initiates us. All the while we are chanting, getting rid of bad habits and relishing delicious prasadam.
Haribol,
Your servant,
Radha Rasamayi DD
Read this answer by Keshava Kashmiri: https://www.quora.com/Is-Devi-Bhagavatam-more-authentic-than-Srimad...
it has everything you need.
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