I have a basic and simple question..
Initially i was one amongst the people who used to ask for the proof of existence of God!
But after a few incidents and experiences, now i'm trying to understand him better and trying to surrender to him.
But this cannot happen in a single day nor that easy ..
In this journey, this is the question that ponders me a lot..!
Why is it preached everywhere to please the supreme Lord in order to cross the ocean of miseries or to attain salvation??
He is our creator, and as per my understanding:
He is like a mother, and mother never expects anything in return back from the child! She always takes care of you irrespective of your behavior towards her!
Why are we asked to chant the mahamantra for a certain no. of rounds each day, so that you could reach a number, which takes you to him finally??
Sorry but i feel like bribing him..!
Well Bhakthi or devotion cannot be measured or bound within numbers..
I feel we need to chant his name just out of love or pure devotion from the heart!!
P.S.: Sorry in advance if i've offended anyone's feelings!
Replies
Srila Prabhupada always would say, we chant so that we can chant more! So in essence, when we understand that the Lord and his names are non-different, it doesn't make a difference whether you are here or in spiritual world.
Why is it preached? There was once a preacher who went to a coal mine. Somebody asked him what is hell like? He replied it is hot, dark and full of suffering. The miners shrugged and felt it's no different from their coal mine. So the priest said, oh and in hell there are no newspapers! And then people started responding.
We are so used to this existence that we do not think of a possibility of a situation other than the material existence here. So we speak of the spiritual world which is free from the bondage and temporary nature of this world in order to give a direction and an attempt to remind the soul of where it came from.
The rounds are a minimum regulation so we AT LEAST chant a basic minimum in remembrance of the Lord. Nothing stops you from trying more!
Ultimately it is all about connecting with the same Lord, our parent, our eternal friend and to find our way to him. Due to our conditioning we do not naturally respond with 100% so yena kena prakrena - find any means possible to remember him.
To live in a country peacefully the government expects us to obey the laws. Otherwise the government will put us in jail. Are we bribing the government by obeying its laws to live as free citizen in the country.
To get a pass and a degree, the university requires us to listen to its instructions , study well, prescribed attendance and work hard. Are we bribing the university by listening to its instructions to get the degree.
We are eternal servants of Krishna and should listen to what he says in Gita. Just as it the duty of the citizen to obey the laws of the government , duty of the student to obey the instructions of the university , it is the duty of the soul to chant the names of the supersoul. We are not bribing. We chant his names out of love.
Haribol,
S.Balaji.
Thank you all for your replies, and nice references and verses & thanx for the detailed explanation..!
@ Radha Rasamayi (Rashmi Khaitan):
First of all thank you for replying, and thanx for such a simple and yet clear explanation..!
I'm convinced with most of your points and agree with it...!
"Man mana bhava mad bhakto...., sarva dharman parityajya..., yat karosi yad asnasi...." I've heard this verse, this is what ponders me a lot..! and due to my very limited understanding or the way i've perceived god, it is very difficult for me to understand and accept this.
I want to read Gita completely and trying to understand him better, but these doubts, doesn't let me to move ahead without completely understanding it..!!
I had always thought, god never expects anything from his children. Is this wrong..?
And according to Gita itself, as he says, he tells surrender to me,chant my name and you reach my supreme abode...
Well i have a lot of questions constantly pondering me, like the "Purpose of this Human Life" and many other things like this... And most of the times i get lost with the constant search of my queries and yet most of my questions unanswered..!
Hare Krsna Prabhuji,
PAMHO.
Thank you for opening up and asking frankly. It is very important that we lay our questions down for others to address them.
To understand Gita, please read from the beginning - ie, Preface, Introduction and then from 1st Shloka of Chapter 1 till the last shloka of Chapter 18. It is not right to read from the middle one shloka here and one shloka there. Whatever doubts you have you can ask on this forum or if you could connect with the local temple and find out about the congregational development in your area, it would be better becasue you will also get association.
YOu could also begin with simpler books like Perfect Questions Perfect Answers, Chant and Be Happy, Life Comes from Life, On the way to Krsna.
Haribol,
Your servant,
Radha Rasamayi DD
Hare Krsna Prabhuji,
PAMHO.
My limited understanding of the matter is that:
1) the way we eat food to provide nutrition to the body, we chant to provide nutrition to the soul. Chanting is food for the soul, that is the reason it has to be done everyday. Why do we keep count? Like everything that is important to us, we account for it or keep count of it, that same way we keep count of the number of rounds we chant. Now if someone tells us to eat 2-3 square meals a day, dont they also tell us what should be in our diet (typically this is a situation when there is an illness and doctor's intervenes in our diet plan and tells us the dos and donts. Similarly we are in spiritual diseased condition, so we need to know how frequently to chant and how many rounds.
2) Its true that a mother takes care of us irrespective of our behaviour, its also true that a mother can chastise her child for his own benefit. Then if we are accepting God as mother, we shoudl nto cry when we face trials and tribulations and ask "why me' or shout - God You dont exist. Who said God doesnt expect anything from us - He says in Gita - Man mana bhava mad bhakto...., sarva dharman parityajya..., yat karosi yad asnasi...... He is giving direct instructions telling us the purpose of human form of life. The beauty is - He is still supplying all our needs without charging anything from us and also, even if we are not following His instructions - still He is taking care of us. He is therefore greater than mother.
Agreed bhakti or devotion cannot be measured or bound within numbers. Chanting and keeping track of number of rounds chanted is the means to achieve devotion as well as the end. Its not that after we attain pure love of God, we will not have to chant anymore. We continue to do - just the level of consciousness is higher - realisation is deeper - the surrender is more complete.
I hope I have been able to answer your questions. Please feel free to ask more if you have doubts.
Haribol,
YOur servant,
Radha Rasamayi DD
Pray to Lord and ask for something is not bad...
Lord is like father, a child may goes to father for ask something which he may need, although child is incapable to get it own, and if the desire is genuine, father will love to fulfill that desire .. that is reciprocation.
Likewise a fully surrender son doesn't demand anything of his own interest and fully depend upon the will of Lord, and lord will be more pleased to carry on the needs of such devotee.
Devotional Service is process by which one gradually become purifies, in beginning we are in ignorance then we come to light, now we understand how miserable the world is actually, then we try to get out it and desire liberation, then we come to understand that lord is ultimate doer, protector and shelter and further more we see lord in every aspect of life and depend upon his will not even ask for liberation ... so it take time to remove the dirt we have collected for millions of lives.
Why is it preached everywhere to please the supreme Lord in order to cross the ocean of miseries or to attain salvation??
Actually due to false ego we think separate doer but our will should be subordinate to the will of lord, due to this separate enjoyer tendency we have been suffering in this material world....
In reality we are always depends upon lord in every aspect anyhow we cannot cross this ocean without him. ideed we are not please lord for attaining salvation... that is business. Love is something more than that.. we are trying to get mercy of him.
Like there is fire when we put iron rod in fire it gains quality of fire similarly, when we come in contact with Lord who is like fire we become pure. so when serve the lord we become purified, serving means engage senses in Krishna... That is Krishna Consciousness.
We chant to engage senses in service of Krishna, 16 rounds at-least quota but there is no upper limit ...
This regulative practice is called sadhana bhakti.. like in school we have some assignment which we have to complete.
Mind is very restless and tough to control so it is difficult in neophyte state to engage oneself 24 hrs a in Krishna but with practice we can come to level of attachment then we naturally attracted to Krishna no external force is required to do bhakti
It is not bribing him, it is a medicine for us ...its difficult to intake but it may cure us...
Krishna is all intelligent, we cannot bribe him in anyway.. he as super-soul knows the wondering of all Jivas but we can chant for his mercy, although his name is so sweet still we have no attraction for him, how unfortunate we all are....
Rupa Goswmai says why lord you have given me only two ears, i wish i have thousands of ears so that i can relish the taste of your holy name.
Holy name of lord is sweetest and non-different of Krishna, but due to our present conditioning we are unable to relish it ...
We may think we become pure and doesn't need any prescribed quota but in pure state one always want to chant the name of lord there is no concept of 16 rounds ... one is always full of Krishna but that attraction is not yet developed but we can gradually become pure by taking self vow of practice otherwise we are always attracted to glitter of this worlds and gradually goes out of KC...
So do not chant to count the rounds but chant them as we are somehow or trying to engage in service of Krishna, although we have no taste but we have now get this spiritual Gem of holy name but we are unable to use it.
Very nice references and replies by all devotees.
Just cant resist to share some Krishna Katha by acharyas.
A pure devotee, who is attached to the activities of devotional service and who always engages in the service of My lotus feet, never desires to become one with Me. Such a devotee, who is unflinchingly engaged, always glorifies My pastimes and activities.(SB 3.25.34)
sva-dharma-niṣṭhaḥ śata-janmabhiḥ pumān
viriñcatām eti tataḥ paraṁ hi mām
avyākṛtaṁ bhāgavato’tha vaiṣṇavaṁ
padaṁ yathāhaṁ vibudhāḥ kalātyaye
A person scrupulously devoted to his occupational duty for one hundred births becomes eligible to occupy the post of Brahmā, and if he becomes yet more qualified, he can attain me (Lord Śiva). A worshiper of the complete Whole, Bhagavān, however, is immediately promoted to the abode of the Complete (vaiṣṇavaṁ padam), which is free of all divisions or modifications (avyākṛtam), just as the other gods and I go there after the destruction of our subtle bodies. (SB 4.24.29)
vrajalila parikarastha sringaradi bhava madhurye srute dhir idam mama bhuyat iti lobhotpattikale sastra yukty apeksha na syat satyam ca tasyam lobhatvasyaivasiddheh | nahi kenacit sastra drishtya lobhah kriyate napi lobhaniya vastu praptau svasya yogyayogyatva vicarah ko’py udbhavati. kintu lobhaniya vastuni srute drishte va svata eva lobha utpadyate || (RVC 1.5 by Srila Vishvanath Chakravarty Thakura.
“If, upon hearing of the sweetness of the feelings, headed by passion, of Sri Krsna’s associates in the Vraja-lila, one thinks, ‘Let me also attain such feelings,’ then at this time one need not depend either on the revealed scriptures or on favorable logical considerations. If such dependence remains, it cannot be said that greed has appeared. Greed never arises in anyone because of scriptural considerations, and in anyone who is desirous to attain the object of the greed, no considerations of qualification or lack of qualification arise. Rather, greed arises only by hearing about the object of greed or by seeing it.”
As love cannot arise due to commandments or as the outcome of a certain pattern of reasoning, it is not possible that eligibility for raganuga-bhakti would arise on account of scriptural commandments or the subsequent logical considerations. Indeed, one who becomes greedy for Vraja-bhava hastens to attain it wherever it is available.
Desire to serve Lord in the association of Nitya siddhas(in his abode ) with the same bhavas is certainly recommended . If one reads the 51 Prarthanas and Prema Bhakti Chandrika of Srila Narottama Das Thakura Mahasaya , he will certainly understand this.
However the key attitude is always to serve RadhaKrishna . In advanced stage of devotion(later stages of asakti ) one is able to relish , see and participate in the sweet pastimes of Lord in this body also in manasi seva in his own spiritual body . So that advanced devotee is not concerned about liberation though he is already liberated. He is not bothered as he has already attained his goal being in the same material body.
So one must chant to attain the direct seva of Lord . We should aspire for association with Lord as Lord also aspires that we are always with Him in his lilas.
If you think He is like mother which never expect anything in return, then you need to weep for Her like the small kid, lost in a dark and dangerous forest.
You can't suck up to me"
And friend you got me wrong I din mean I like to bribe him, I meant people chanting his mantra particular number of times with hope to attain salvation feels like bribing to me!
And my question was, why are we asked to chant the mantra a particular no. of rounds daily .. n thereby we reach a number which helps us to attain him..
One should immerse and devote completely to him when chanting and how can he do tat when he s trying to have track of counts and accomplishing it like a task given ..?