A question many times arise, many hold this opinion regarding upanisads that upanisads talks about Impersonal Brahman, Shiva etc. But this view is not truth rather absurd beacuse the teachings of Upanisads should be inline with teachings of Bhagavad Gita, Vedanta Sutra, Purusha Suktam, mahabharata, Ramayana etc. we can't take just few context out of any upanisads or any scripture and establish any view according to that, a truth can only be established when it supported by other scriptures.

Like some upanisads talks about impersonal aspect of god for e.g.

Svetasvatara Upanisad (3.10): tato yad uttarataram tad arupam anamayam/ ya etad vidur amrtas te bhavanti athetare duhkham evapiyanti.

This impersonalist use this verse to show gos has no form (Arupam). But this if we see without seeing other verses of the same upanisads then we really conclude that god is impersonal. But no , beacuse the same upanisads says

Other verses in the Svetasvatara Upanisad (3.8-9) substantiate this as follows:

vedaham etam purusam mahantam aditya-varnam tamasah parastat
tam eva viditvati mrtyum eti nanyah pantha vidyate 'yanaya
yasmat param naparam asti kincid yasman naniyo no jyayo 'sti kincit
vrksa iva stabdho divi tisthaty ekastenedam purnam purusena sarvam

"I know that Supreme Personality of Godhead who is transcendental to all material conceptions of darkness. Only he who knows Him can transcend the bonds of birth and death. There is no way for liberation other than this knowledge of that Supreme Person.

"There is no truth superior to that Supreme Person, because He is the supermost. He is smaller than the smallest, and He is greater than the greatest. He is situated as a silent tree, and He illumines the transcendental sky, and as a tree spreads its roots, He spreads His extensive energies."

Now few things to understand here that the upanisads first mentioned him arupam ( no form) again in other verses declared he is Purusha (Person) . So what should we conclude, it seems apparant contradiction , but there is no contradiction beacuse Arupam used for that the Purusha has no form like us, he has no material form rather he has a transcendental form.

Another thing if we accept few verse of upanisads talks about impersonal accept, and we conclude that absolute truth is impersonal on that basis, then what will we answer to those verse which talks god is personal.

Like in BG Krishna saying

BG 14.27: And I am the basis of the impersonal Brahman, which is immortal, imperishable and eternal and is the constitutional position of ultimate happiness.

BG 9.11: Fools deride Me when I descend in the human form. They do not know My transcendental nature and My supreme dominion over all that be.

BG 7.24: Unintelligent men, who do not know Me perfectly, think that I, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Kṛṣṇa, was impersonal before and have now assumed this personality. Due to their small knowledge, they do not know My higher nature, which is imperishable and supreme.

How can we deny the verses of Isha upanisads:

Iso 15: O my Lord, sustainer of all that lives, Your real face is covered by Your dazzling effulgence. Kindly remove that covering and exhibit Yourself to Your pure devotee.

Iso 16: O my Lord, O primeval philosopher, maintainer of the universe, O regulating principle, destination of the pure devotees, well-wisher of the progenitors of mankind, please remove the effulgence of Your transcendental rays so that I can see Your form of bliss. You are the eternal Supreme Personality of Godhead, like unto the sun, as am I.

So shastra should be read as a whole, not as a part, else we will jump in worng conclusion, beacuse if we conclude god is impersonal then we have to refute Bhagavad Gita and Upanisads other statements. But is this possible, that means our understanding is wrong.

Also it happens sometime that other gods name like Shiva occuring in upanisads like in svetasvatara upanisads 5.4 , but this Shiva is nothing but other Name of Vishnu beacuse

27) shivah: He who is eternally pure

600) shivah: Auspiciousness

The both names appears in the 27th name of Vishnu in Vishnu sahsranama.

Again to confirm this Krishna saying

BG 10.23: Of all the Rudras I am Lord Śiva, of the Yakṣas and Rākṣasas I am the Lord of wealth [Kuvera], of the Vasus I am fire [Agni], and of mountains I am Meru.

So this confirms That Vishnu is Shiva and not the other way around, thus Upanisad can't say Siva is supreme in these verse , because its simply not supported by Vedanta-sutra, Bhagavd Gita, Purusha Suktam and other verse of Upanisads.

Hence Shastra should and can only be understandable when we follow proper source and bonafide paramapara rather than trying to intrepret on own whim. Any verse from any shastra shoulb be confirmed by Prashtana traya (Vedanta-sutra, Upanisads and BG) . Bhagavad Gita is the basis and other should be inline with this. Else that interpretation has no value.


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              • Sevak

                Dear Darian prabhu,

                Once again you put the same argument.

                Krishna says in Bhagavad Gita 15.15:

                sarvasya cāhaḿ hṛdi sanniviṣṭo
                mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanaḿ ca
                vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyo
                vedānta-kṛd veda-vid eva cāham

                I am seated in everyone's heart, and from Me come remembrance, knowledge and forgetfulness. By all the Vedas, I am to be known. Indeed, I am the compiler of Vedānta, and I am the knower of the Vedas.

                Now prabhu do you have any problem with understanding this verse of Bhagavad Gita which is the essence of Vedas? Hare Krishna.

                Your Servant.

            • Sevak

              Dear prabhu,

              Once again please follow authentic parampara and interpretation of scripture. Shaivist blogs are not an bona fide authority. As far as scriptures go, they only mention 4 bona fide guru pramparas:

              Garga samhita 10.61.23-26 states:

              vamanas vidhi sesah sanako visnu vakyatah
              dharmartha hetave caite bhavisyanti dvijah kalau
              visnusvami vamanamsas tatha madhvastu brahmanah
              ramanujas tu sesamsa nimbaditya sanakasya ca
              ete kalau yuge bhavyah sampradaya pravartakah
              samvatsare vikrama catvarah ksiti pavanah
              sampradaya vihina ye mantraste nisphalah smritah
              tasmac ca gamanam hy asti sampradaya narair api
              "Vamana, Brahma, Ananta Sesa, Sanaka Kumara will appear as brahmanas by the order of Visnu for the preservation of eternal righteousness in Kali yuga. Visnusvami, Madhvacarya, Ramanuja and Nimbaditya will appear respectively as a portion of Vamana, Brahma, Ananta Sesa and Sanaka Kumara. These four saviors will be the establishers of the four authorised and empowered spiritual channels of disciplic succession in the period calcuated from the reign of King Vikrama [in 54 BC] subsequently through the 432 000 year cycle of Kali yuga. These four authorised and empowered spiritual channels of disciplic succession are to be fully accepted by all beings; as any word, combination of words pr formulation of sound frequencies, invoked or addressed, audible or inaudible, secret of revealed, ancient or contemporary outside their auspices prove to have absolutely no efficacy."

              So please accept the words of the acaryas of the 4 sampradya like Madhvacarya, Ramanuja, Cahitanya Mahaprabhu etc. Saivists are not bona fide authority as they run against acaryas and sastra.

              Also Padma Purana says:

              sampradāyavihīnā ye mantrāste niṣphalā matāḥ
              ataḥ kalau bhaviśyanti catvāraḥ sampradāyinaḥ
              Śrī-brahmā-rudra-sanakā vaiṣṇavā kṣitipāvanāḥ
              catvāraste kalau bhāvya hyutkale puruṣottamāt
              rāmānujaṃ śrī svicakre madhvācaryaṃ caturmukhaḥ
              śrīviṣṇusvāminaṃ rudro nimbādityaṃ catuḥsanāḥ

              All mantras which have been given (to disciples) not in an authorised Sampradāya are fruitless. Therefore, in Kali Yuga, there will be four bona-fide Sampradāyas. Each of them were ignaugurated by Śrī Devī and known as the Śrī Sampradāya, Lord Brahmā and known as the Brahmā Sampradāya,Lord Rudra and known as the Rudra Sampradāya; and the Four Kumāras and known as Sanakādi Sampradāya. Śrī Devī made Rāmānujācārya the head of that lineage. So too Lord Brahmā appointed Madhvācārya, Lord Rudra appointed Viṣṇusvāmī and the four Kumaras chose Nimbāditya (an epithet for Śrī Nimbārkācārya).

              Thank you very much. Hare Krishna.

              Your servant.

          • "These are not my words" but I have found on a website which describes much more detail of the Upanishad. All thanks to Har Har Mahadev Blogspot.


            Lord Rudra --- The Heart of Rishi Śvetāśvatara.


            Śvetāśvatara Upanishad was attributed to a sage called "Shvetashvatara" or to his line of ancient spiritual teachers. The name "Shvetashvatara" is not uncommon in vedic literature. It means "White Mule". The Mule was a prized animal in ancient vedic India. A person who owns a white horse is called "Shvetashva" and one who owns a white mule can be called "Shvetashvatara". One of Arjuna's names in the epic Mahabharata is "Shvetashva." In the Rigveda, too, we find a sage's name as "Shyavashva," meaning "One who owns a black horse."

            " Sage Shvetashvatara got this knowledge of Brahman, which is very sacred and revered by many great sages, through his penance and through God's grace, and he taught it very well to his disciples."

            ( Śvetāśvatara Upanishad VI-21)

            From the above verse, it is clear that the seer of the upanishad is Rishi Svetasvatara.

            Vaishnavite attacks:

            The vaishnavites quote several verses of the upanishad in their respective treatises in support of their claims. The special feature of the Upanishad is the prominent conception of Devotion or Bhakti. In other Upanishads, the concept of Bhakti is indirectly voiced in the form of Upasana, but here, leaving no room for guesswork, it is explicitly mentioned. The word para-bhakti is explicitly used at the end of the sixth chapter. There are many words which voice submission to God or Brahman (words such as Sharanam, Prapadye, etc.). This concept of devotion later found profound expression in the Bhakti Sutras and other treatises on Bhakti. So the vaishnava acharyas quote the verses from Svetasvatara upanishad in support if their 'Bhakti' doctrine. Of course, they can do so.

            But unfortunately, Some vaishnavas are over enthusiastic and try to claim that Rishi Svetasvatara was not a worshipper of Lord Shiva. They even say that Rishi Svetasvatara used the word 'Rudra' as an epithet of Lord Vishnu but not to refer 'Rudra' ( a demi-god in their view) of vedas. But such useless ramblings only bring disgrace to the vaishnava sect. A careful analysis of both Śvetāśvatara Upanishad and vedas prove beyond any reasonable doubt that the Rudra of Śvetāśvatara Upanishad and the Rudra of Vedas are one and the same. it is really foolish to think that Rishi Svetasvatara used the word 'Rudra' to refer someone else other than vedik Rudra.

            Rudra of Śvetāśvatara Upanishad is none other than Rudra of vedas.

            Actually, most of the people do not know the fact that several mantras used in Śvetāśvatara Upanishad were actually adapted from Veda samhitas. That's why the Śvetāśvatara Upanishad is popular as 'Mantra Upanishad' . The hymns in praise of Rudra in Śvetāśvatara Upanishad were actually taken from Samhita portions of Rigveda, Yajurveda, and Atharvana Veda.


            yo devo agnau yo’psu

            yo viśvaṃ bhuvanam āviveśa

            ya oṣadhīṣu yo vanaspatiṣu

            tasmai devāya namo namaḥ ( Śvetāśvatara Upanishad II-17 )

            The Self—luminous Lord, who is fire, who is in water, who has entered into the whole world, who is in plants, who is in trees— to that Lord let there be adoration! Yea, let there be adoration!

            The above mantra was actually adapted from Yajurveda Taittiriya Samhita. The verse is addressed to Rudra. The verse describes the omnipresence of Lord Rudra. It says that Rudra is the indweller of elements of nature and beings as well. So it is clear that the Rudra of Śvetāśvatara Upanishad is none other than lord Rudra of Vedas.

            Adapted from:

            Yo rudro agnau yo apsu ya oshhadhishhu

            Yo rudro vishva bhuvanaaavivesha tasmai rudraya namo astu (YV 5:5:9-i )

            MEANING: The Rudra in the fire, in the waters, in the plants, the Rudra that hath entered all beings, to that Rudra be homage.


            eko hi rudro na dvitīyāya tasthur

            ya imāṃl lokān īśata īśanībhiḥ

            pratyaṅ janāṃs tiṣṭhati sañcukocānta-kāle

            saṃsṛjya viśvā bhuvanāni gopāḥ ( SV Up III-2)

            Meaning :

            Rudra is truly one; for the knowers of Brahman do not admit the existence of a second, He alone rules all the worlds by His powers. He dwells as the inner Self of every living being. After having created all the worlds, He, their Protector, takes them back into Himself at the end of time.

            The above verse clearly says that Rudra is truly one. Rishi Svetasvatara reasserts "Ekam eva advitiyam Brahma". This verse which proclaims the absoluteness of Lord Rudra was also adapted from Taittiriya samhita. The verse clearly refutes the vaishnavite claims that Rudra is a demi-god and subordinate to Vishnu. Lord Rudra is not a demi god but lord Rudra is Absolute brahman who is beyond the comprehension of human minds. Vedas testify the absoluteness of Lord Rudra. This verse also makes it clear that Rudra of Śvetāśvatara Upanishad is none other than lord Rudra of Vedas.

            Adapted from:

            Eka eva rudra na dvitīyāya tasthur ( Yajurveda 1:8:6 d)

            ie., Rudra is truly one for the knowers of Brahman do not admit the existence of a second.


            viśvataś cakṣur uta viśvato-mukho

            viśvato-bāhur uta viśvatas-pāt

            saṃ6 bāhubhyāṃ dhamati sampatatrair

            dyāv-ābhūmī janayan deva ekaḥ ( Sv Up III-3)

            His eyes are everywhere, His faces everywhere, His arms everywhere, everywhere His feet. He it is who endows men with arms, birds with feet and wings and men likewise with feet. Having produced heaven and earth, this God (deva ekaḥ) remains as their non—dual manifester.

            yā te rudra śivā tanūr aghorā’pāpa-kāśinī

            tayā nas tanuvā śantamayā giriśantābhicākaśīh ( Sv Up III-5)

            Lord Rudra, you who dwell on Mount Kailas and who confer happiness, by that

            form of yours which is not terrible, which will not injure us, and which is highly

            auspicious, behold and illuminate us.

            The above verse of Svetasvatara upanishad asks Rudra to shower his blessings in auspicious form. This verse is like a jolt upon those vaishnavas who claim that Rudra of svetasvatara upanishad is different from Rudra of vedas whom the advaitins and Shaivates worship. This verse is taken 'AS-IT-IS' from the popular Sri Rudram portion of Yajurveda. The Vaishnavites often say that Rudra,who is worshiped by Advaitins and shaivates by chanting Rudram, is a demi-god and subordinate to Vishnu. So they say that the Rudra of Śvetāśvatara upanishad is Vishnu but not Rudra of Shaivates. Such senseless claims of vaisnavas are rebutted by this verse. If Śvetāśvatara maharshi's Rudra is different from Shaivates' Rudra then why did he take this mantra "AS-IT-IS" from Sri Rudram ? if Śvetāśvatara maharshi want to distinguish between his Rudra and Shaivates' Rudra then he wouldn't have quoted from Sri Rudram at all.

            Adapted from:

            yā te rudra śivā tanūr aghorā’pāpa-kāśinī

            tayā nas tanuvā śantamayā giriśantābhicākaśīh ( YV Taittiriya Samhita IV-5-1-c)


            yābhiṣuṃ giriśanta haste bibharṣy astave

            śivāṃ giritra tāṃ kuru mā hiṃsīḥ puruṣaṃ jagat ( SV Up III-6)

            My Lord who dwells on Mount Kailas and confers gladness to all! You, who fulfills

            your vow of protecting all who serve you and take refuge in you; that arrow of

            yours which you hold ready to let fly, withhold it and make it tranquil and


            The above verse is once again a jolt upon such vaishnavas. Because this verse is also taken 'AS-IT-IS' from Sri Rudram portion of yajurveda. If Śvetāśvatara maharshi's Rudra is different from Shaivates' Rudra then why did he take this mantra "AS-IT-IS" from Sri Rudram ? if Śvetāśvatara maharshi want to distinguish between his Rudra and Shaivates' Rudra then he wouldn't have quoted from Sri Rudram at all. Of course, there are a category of vaishnavas who conveniently changes their color just like chameleon. They argue that the Sri Rudram portion of Vedas are refering to Narayana but not Rudra of Shaivates. This is really a funny claim. it is something similar like 'Vishnu of vaishnavas is not same as Vishnu of Vishnu puran or pancharatra agama'. The shaivates are not bothered about any other Rudra whom the Vaishnavites are referring to. For Shaivates, God is 'Rudra' who is eulogized in Sri Rudram, Who is eulogized in Rigveda samhita with name 'Rudra', Who is eulogized in Atharvana veda with names 'Rudra' 'Sarva' Bhava' 'vratya' skambha...etc, Who is eulogized in Brahmanas as 'Mahadeva' , Who is eulogized in Aranyakas, who is eulogized in kena upanishad as Lord of Uma hymavati (umapati). who is eulogized as 'Maheswara', 'Parameswara', 'iswara' , 'Hara', 'Shiva' 'Ishana' in Svetasvatara upanishad. Shaivates are unaware of any other 'Rudra' whom these vaishnavas are referring.

            Adapted from :

            yābhiṣuṃ giriśanta haste bibharṣy astave

            śivāṃ giritra tāṃ kuru mā hiṃsīḥ puruṣaṃ jagat ( YV Taittiriya samhita IV-5-1 d)


            tvaṃ strī pumān asi

            tvaṃ kumāra uta vā kumārī

            tvaṃ jīrṇo daṇḍena vañcasi

            tvaṃ jāto bhavasi viśvato-mukhaḥ ( SV Up IV-3)


            Thou art a woman, and a man; thou art a damsel and a boy.

            Grown old thou totterest with a staff, new-born thou lookest every way.

            The above verse describes Lord Rudra as everyone and everything. But this verse is adapted from the Skambha Suktam of Atharvana Veda samhita. 'Skambha' means 'pillar'. Lord Rudra appeared as pillar without begining or ending. Both Hari and Brahma failed to know the origin and end of skambha. 'Linga' is a symbol of Skambha.

            Adapted From:

            tváṃ strī́ tváṃ púmān asi tváṃ kumārá utá vā kumārī́||

            tváṃ jīrṇó daṇḍéna vañcasi tváṃ jātó bhavasi viśvátomukhaḥ (Atharva Veda Śamhita 10,8.27)


            yo devānām adhipo

            yasmin lokā adhiśritāḥ

            ya īśe asya dvipadaś catuṣpadaḥ

            kasmai devāya haviṣā vidhema ( SV Up IV-13 )


            He who is the sovereign of the gods, in whom the worlds find their support, who rules over all two—footed and four—footed beings—let us serve that God, radiant and blissful, with an oblation.

            Here Śvetāśvatara maharshi calls Rudra is called as Lord of both two-footed and four-footed. (ya īśe asya dvipadaś catuṣpadaḥ). This epithet is not a new one. In Veda samhitas, Rudra is always adressed as the lord of both two-footed and four-footed. Rudra is addressed as Lord of two-footed and four-footed for more than 100 times. So from this, it is clear that Rudra of Svetasvatara and Rudra of Vedas are both one and the same.

            Adapted from:

            bhávāśarvau manvé vāṃ tásya vittaṃ yáyor vām idáṃ pradíśi yád virócate

            yā́v asyéśāthe dvipádo yáu cátuṣpadas táu no muñcatam áṃhasaḥ ( Athava veda IV-28-1)

            O Bhava and Sarva, I am devoted to you. Take note of that, you under whose control, is all this which shines (the visible universe)! You rule all these two-footed and four-footed creatures, you, Deliver us from grief and trouble.

            yáyor vadhā́n nā́papádyate káś canā́ntár devéṣūtá mā́nuṣeṣu

            yā́v asyéśathe dvipádo yáu cátuṣpadas táu no muñcatam áṃhasaḥ ( Athava veda IV-28-5)

            You from whose blows no one either among gods or men escapes; you who rule all these two-footed and four-footed creatures, deliver us from grief and trouble.


            sūkṣmātisūkṣmaṃ kalilasya madhye

            viśvasya sraṣṭāram aneka-rūpam

            viśvasyaikaṃ pariveṣṭitāraṃ

            jñātvā śivaṃ śāntim atyantam eti ( SV Up IV-14 )

            Finer beyond fineness. He hath hidden him in the midmost of this hustling chaos. He hath created this universe by taking many figures and as the One He encompasseth it around and girdeth it; having known Shiva, the Blessed One, man goeth to unutterable peace

            The above verse explicitly identifies Lord Rudra with Shiva. The words " jñātvā śivaṃ " clearly says that the absolute is to be known or realised as SHIVA.,then only one can have supreme peace. If Lord Rudra is not 'Shiva' of Shaivates then why is Śvetāśvatara Maharshi saying that the absolute is to be known as 'Shiva'. (jñātvā śivaṃ) ?

            ghṛtāt paraṃ maṇḍam ivātisūkṣmaṃ

            jñātvā śivaṃ sarva-bhūteṣu gūḍham

            viśvasyaikaṃ pariveṣṭitāraṃ

            jñātvā devaṃ mucyate sarva-pāśaiḥ ( SV Up IV-16)

            As the rare and fine cream in clarified butter, and it is richer than the butter, so Shiva the Blessed One hath hidden Him in every one of all His creatures; but as the One He encompasseth this whole world and girdeth it around. Know God and thou breakest every bondage.

            Here again Rishi Śvetāśvatara telling us to realise that, it is Shiva who resides in the hearts of all beings. (jñātvā śivaṃ sarva-bhūteṣu gūḍham ).


            yadā’tamas tan na divā na rātrir

            na san na cāsac chiva eva kevalaḥ

            tad akṣaraṃ tat savitur vareṇyaṃ

            prajñā ca tasmāt prasṛtā purāṇī (SV Up IV-18)

            When there is no darkness of ignorance, there is no day or night, neither being nor non—being; SHIVA alone exists. That immutable Reality is the meaning of "That"; It is adored by the Sun. From It has proceeded the ancient wisdom.

            Oh... here once again !! Rishi Śvetāśvatara proclaimed "Shiva eva kevalaḥ" ie., Shiva alone exists. if Svetasvatara Rishi's Lord Rudra is different from the Shiva of Shaivates why is he using the word 'Shiva' again and again ?


            ajāta ity evaṃ kaścid bhīruḥ prapadyate

            rudra yat te dakṣiṇaṃ mukhaṃ tena māṃ pāhi nityam ( SV Up IV-21)

            It is because Thou, O Lord, art birthless, that some rare souls, frightened by birth and death, take refuge in Thee. O Rudra, may Thy benign face protect me for ever!

            Here Maharshi Śvetāśvatara says that only rare souls take refuge(prapadyate) of Rudra. He is asking Rudra's bengin face (dakṣiṇaṃ mukhaṃ) to protect forever. Here Rishi takes refugee of Shiva's bengin form ie., Dakshina murthy. Rudra has both Ghora and Aghora forms.


            mā nas toke tanaye mā na āyuṣi

            mā no goṣu mā na aśveṣu rīriṣaḥ

            vīrān mā no rudra bhāmito

            vadhīr haviṣmantaḥ sadāmit tvā havāmahe ( SV Up IV-22)

            O Rudra, do not, in Thy wrath, destroy our children and grand—children. Do not destroy our lives; do not destroy our cows or horses; do not destroy our strong servants. For we invoke Thee always, with oblations, for our protection.

            The above verse is also taken 'AS IT IS' from Sri Rudram portion of Yajurveda. Here Rudra is asked to show mercy upon the progency. It is typical to Rudra in vedas. If Lord Rudra of Svetasvatara maharshi is different from the Rudra of vedas, why has he taken Sri Rudram verse 'AS IT IS' ? So it is very clear that Rudra of Shaivates and Rudra of Svetasvatara Upanishad are one and the same.

            Adapted from:

            Manastoke tanaye ma na ayushhi ma no goshhu ma no ashveshhu ririshhah

            Viranma no rudra bhamitoavadhi rhavishhmanto namasa vidhema te ( Yajur veda TS IV-5-10-f)

            Lord Rudra! Getting angry at our transgressions hurts not only our children, our

            sons in particular, but also our cattle and horses, and our warriors.

            Making offerings into the sacred fire, we shall serve and calm you by our

            Namaskars (salutations).

        • Volunteer

          Extracts from Mahabharata.



          myself and bramha both were come out of your own divine form thus your name became “KESAVA”

          In the Moksha-dharma Krishna also says,

          prajapatim ca rudram capy
          aham eva srijami vai
          tau hi mam na vijanito
          mama maya-vimohitau

          The patriarchs, Shiva and others are created by Me, though they do not know that they are created by Me because they are deluded by My illusory energy.” In the Varaha Purana it is also said, 

          narayanah paro devas
          tasmaj jatas caturmukhah
          tasmad rudro ’bhavad devah
          sa ca sarva-jnatam gatah

          Narayana is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and from Him Brahma was born, from whom Shiva was born.” 

          Mahabharata as a whole always concluded Visnu is para-brahman(the origin of everything). few chapters are later interpolated by other followers to support their deity's supremacy, but one can easily understand after reading the whole mahabharata and Acharya's conclusion that things are later injected.

          Madhvacharya accepted this in his "Mahabharata Tatparya Nirnaya"

          Sri vaishnava sampradaya also accept this.

          • Sevak

            Rig Veda ( states:
            apazyaM gopAm aNipadyamA namA
            ca parA ca pathibhiz carantam sa-sadhRIcIH
            sa viSucIr vasAna AvarIvartti-bhuvaneSv antaH
            I saw a boy who appeared in the dynasty of cowherds. He is infallible and is never annihilated. He wanders on various paths, sometimes near and sometimes very far. Sometimes He is beautifully adorned with varieties of garments, and sometimes He wears cloth of only one color. In this way, He repeatedly exhibits His manifest and unmanifest pastimes.

            Aranyopanisad 5th mantra it is said:
            tad visnoh paramam padam sada pasyanti surayah
            diviva caksur atatam visnor yat paramam padam
            The wise continuously see the highest form of Visnu. This supreme form, perceived with spiritual eyes, is Krsna.

            Chandogya Upanisad 8.13.1: 
            syamac chavalam prapadye
            savalac chyamam pradadye
            In surrendering to syama, Krsna I take shelter of the essence of the pleasure potency. In taking shelter of the pleasure potency, I surrender to Krsna.

            Srimad Bhagavatam10.14.52

            enam avehi tvam atmanam jagad atmanam 
            O King, understand that Krsna is the soul of all souls of the universe.

            In the GopAla-tApani Upanishad (Pürva 2.8) it is stated:
            eko vazI sarva-gaH kRSNa IDyaH
            eko ’pi san bahudhA yo ’vabhAti
            Sri KRSNa is the all-pervasive, non-dual para-brahma who controls everything. He is the only worshipable object for all the devatAs, for mankind, and for all other life-forms.
            Although He is one, through His acintya-zakti He manifests many forms and performs many varieties of lilAs.

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    Adapted from Krishna Kathamrita by Madhavananda Dasa




    Learned scholars in transcendental subjects have carefully analyzed the summum bonum Krishna to have sixty-four principal attributes. All the expansions or categories of the Lord possess only some percentages of these attributes. But Shri Krishna is the possessor of the attributes cent percent. And His personal

    expansions such as svayam-prakasa, tad-ekatma up to the categories of the avataras who are all vishnu-tattva, possess up to ninety-three percent of these transcendental attributes. Lord Siva, who is neither avatara nor avesa nor in between them, possesses almost eighty-four percent of the attributes.(sb



    kshiram yatha dadhi vikara-visesha-yogat

    sanjayate na tu tatah prithag asti hetoh

    yah sambhutam api tatha samupaiti karyad

    govindam adi-purusham tam aham bhajami


    “‘Milk changes into yogurt when mixed with a yogurt culture, but actually it is constitutionally nothing but milk. Similarly, Govinda, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, assumes the form of Lord Siva [Sambhu] for the special purpose of material transactions. I offer my obeisances at His lotus feet.’ (The real nature of Sambhu, the presiding deity of Mahesa-dhama, is described.) Sambhu is not a second Godhead other than Krishna. Those, who entertain such discriminating sentiment, commit a great offense against the Supreme Lord. The supremacy of Sambhu is subservient to that of Govinda; hence they are not really different from each other. The nondistinction is established by the fact that just as milk treated with acid turns into curd so

    Godhead becomes a subservient when He Himself attains a distinct personality by the addition of a particular element of adulteration. This personality has no independent initiative. The said adulterating principle is constituted of a combination of the stupefying quality of the deluding energy, the quality of nonplenitude of the marginal potency and a slight degree of the ecstatic-cum-cognitive principle of the plenary spiritual potency. This specifically adulterated reflection of the principle of the subjective portion of the Divinity is

    Sadasiva, in the form of the effulgent masculine-symbol-god Sambhu from whom Rudradeva is manifested. In the work of mundane creation as the material cause, in the work of preservation by the destruction of sundry asuras and in the work of destruction to conduct the whole operation, Govinda manifests Himself as

    guna-avatara in the form of Sambhu who is the separated portion of Govinda imbued with the principle of His subjective plenary portion. The personality of the destructive principle in the form of time has been identified with that of Sambhu by scriptural evidences that have been adduced in the commentary. The purport of the Bhagavata slokas, viz., vaishnavanam yatha sambhuh, etc., is that Sambhu, in pursuance of the will of Govinda, works in union with his consort Durgadevi by his own time energy. He teaches pious duties (dharma) as stepping-stones to the attainment of spiritual service in the various tantra-sastras, etc., suitable for jivas in different grades of the conditional existence. In obedience to the will of Govinda, Sambhu maintains and fosters the religion of pure devotion by preaching the cult of illusionism (Mayavada) and the speculative agama-sastras. The fifty attributes of individual souls are manifest in a far vaster measure in Sambhu and five additional attributes not attainable by jivas are also partly found in him. So Sambhu cannot be called a jiva. He is the lord of jiva but yet partakes of the nature of a separated portion of Govinda. (brahma samhita 5.45)



    There is a Mission that regularly propounds that worship of any demigod will lead one to the Supreme Personality of Godhead, or the supreme goal. But worship of demigods is thoroughly discouraged herein because even the greatest demigods like Brahma and Siva represent only part of the opulence of the Supreme Lord. He is the origin of everyone born, and no one is greater than Him. He is asamaurdhva, which means that no one is superior to Him and that no one is equal to Him. In the Padma Purana it is said that one who considers the Supreme Lord Krishna in the same category with demigods—be they even Brahma or Siva—becomes at once an atheist.(BG 10.42)


    There are many foolish persons who say that one can chant Hare Krishna or chant the name of Kali or Durga or Siva because they are all the same. If one thinks that the holy name of the Supreme Personality of Godhead and the names and activities of the demigods are on the same level, or if one accepts the holy

    name of Vishnu to be a material sound vibration, that is also an offense. (SB 3.15.25)



    It is said, vaishnavanam yatha sambhuh: Lord Siva is the best of all devotees. Therefore all devotees of Lord Krishna are also devotees of Lord Siva. In Vrindavana there is Lord Siva's temple called Gopisvara. The gopis used to worship not only Lord Siva but Katyayani, or Durga, as well, but their aim was to attain the favor of Lord Krishna. A devotee of Lord Krishna does not disrespect Lord Siva, but worships Lord Siva as the most exalted devotee of Lord Krishna. Consequently whenever a devotee worships Lord Siva, he prays to Lord Siva to achieve the favor of Krishna, and he does not request material profit. In Bhagavad-gita (7.20) it is said that generally people worship demigods for some material profit. Kamais tais tair hrita jnanah. Driven by material lust, they worship demigods, but a devotee never does so, for he is never driven by material lust. That is the difference between a devotee's respect for Lord Siva and an asura's respect for him. The asura worships Lord Siva, takes some benediction from him, misuses the benediction and ultimately is killed by the Supreme Personality of Godhead, who awards him liberation. Because Lord Siva is a great devotee of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, he loves all the devotees of the Supreme Lord. Lord Siva told the Pracetas that because they were devotees of the Lord, he loved them very much. Lord Siva was not kind and merciful only to the Pracetas; anyone who is a devotee of the Supreme Personality of Godhead is very dear to Lord Siva. Not only are the devotees dear to Lord Siva, but he respects them as much as he respects the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Similarly, devotees of the Supreme Lord also

    worship Lord Siva as the most dear devotee of Lord Krishna. They do not worship him as a separate Personality of Godhead. It is stated in the list of nama-aparadhas that it is an offense to think that the chanting of the name of Hari and the chanting of Hara, or Siva, are the same. The devotees must always

    know that Lord Vishnu is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and that Lord Siva is His devotee. A devotee should be offered respect on the level of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and sometimes even more respect. Indeed, Lord Rama, the Personality of Godhead Himself, sometimes worshiped Lord Siva. If a

    devotee is worshiped by the Lord, why should a devotee not be worshiped by other devotees on the same level with the Lord? This is the conclusion. From this verse it appears that Lord Siva blesses the asuras simply for the sake of formality. Actually he loves one who is devoted to the Supreme Personality of

    Godhead. (purport SB 4.24.30)



    Devotee: Shrila Prabhupada, in Winnipeg there is one very pious east Indian man who for many years has been worshiping somewhat, worshiping Lord Siva. And his wife is also a very quite chaste woman and sincere follower—and so were her parents—of Lord Siva. And he is reading your Bhagavad-gita. He visits our

    temple. And I have given him the first volume of Canto Four which discusses Lord Siva a great deal. And he has read in one of your purports that Krishna is more pleased when you worship His devotee than when you worship Him directly. And Lord Siva is a very great devotee of Krishna. So he has now interpreted that

    to mean that if he worships Lord Siva so nicely, then actually he is pleasing Krishna more. So he is experiencing some difficulty because of this and I'm not quite sure how to instruct him that actually...

    Prabhupada: Difficulty?

    Brahmananda: That... Our Godbrother has difficulty in replying to this interpretation that Krishna says, "You can please Me by worshiping My devotee," and Lord Siva is the devotee of Krishna. So therefore this man says, "Then I shall worship Lord Siva. In that way I shall please Krishna."

    Prabhupada: But if he accepts Lord Siva is devotee of Krishna, then by worshiping Lord Siva he will be benefited. If he thinks Lord Siva is independent, then he will not be benefited.

    Devotee (3): I've got him to accept that Lord Siva is devotee of Krishna, but there's no practical instruction in his worldly activities coming.

    Prabhupada: No, vaishnavanam yatha sambhuh: "Amongst the Vaishnavas, Sambhu, Lord Siva, is the greatest Vaishnava." So we worship Lord Siva as Vaishnava. We gives respect to Vaishnavas. So why not Lord Siva? Lord Siva is a big Vaishnava. But generally, the devotees of Lord Siva, they take Lord Siva is independent God. That is offensive. If you know that Lord Siva is also a devotee, you can give more respect to Lord Siva. Krishna will be pleased. Devotee (3): Shrila Prabhupada, he does not chant Hare Krishna, he chants om sivaya namah.

    Prabhupada: That's all right.

    Devotee (3): It's all right?

    Prabhupada: He will gradually become devotee. When God, Lord Siva, will be pleased upon him, he will advise to worship.

    Devotee (3): He is already trying to tell him to follow in your footsteps surely, so just before I left he said he will try once again to chant sixteen rounds of japa, Hare Krishna. He has tried already. He has a taste for...

    Prabhupada: If he simply understands that Lord Siva is a Vaishnava and if he worships Lord Siva, then he will get the benefit. (ROOM CONVERSTATION, CHICAGO, 9TH JULY 1975)



    It is said that among all the devotees of the Personality of Godhead, Lord Siva is the greatest. Thus the remnants of foodstuff left by him are accepted by other devotees as maha-prasada, or great spiritual foodstuff. The remnants of foodstuff offered to Lord Krishna are called prasada, but when the same prasada is eaten by a great devotee like Lord Siva, it is called maha-prasada. Lord Siva is so great that he does not care for the material prosperity for which every one of us is so eager. Parvati, who is the powerful material nature personified, is under his full control as his wife, yet he does not use her even to build a residential house. He prefers to remain without shelter, and his great wife also agrees to live with him humbly. People in general worship goddess Durga, the wife of Lord Siva, for material prosperity, but Lord Siva engages her in his service without material desire. He simply advises his great wife that of all kinds of worship, the worship of Vishnu is the highest, and greater than that is the worship of a great devotee or anything in relation with Vishnu. (S.B. 3.14.26)



    In the Vamana Purana it is said that the same Vishnu expands Himself as Brahma and Siva to direct the different qualities. ( cc ADI 5.104) Mahesvara, or Lord Siva, is not an ordinary living being, nor is he equal to

    Lord Vishnu. Effectively comparing Lord Vishnu and Lord Siva, the Brahma-samhita says that Vishnu is like milk, whereas Siva is like yogurt. Yogurt is nothing like milk, but nevertheless it is milk also. (CC ADI 1.105)


    Shrila Jiva Gosvami, in his Bhakti-sandarbha (213), has clearly explained that a pure devotee’s observation of the spiritual master and Lord Siva as being one with the Personality of Godhead exists in terms of their being very dear to the Lord, not identical with Him in all respects. (CC ADI 1.46)




    Rudra, who is an expansion of Sadasiva and who appears in unlimited universes, is also a gunavatara [qualitative incarnation] and is the ornament of all the demigods in the endless universes.


    There are eleven expansions of Rudra, or Lord Siva. They are as follows: Ajaikapat, Ahibradhna, Virupaksha, Raivata, Hara, Bahurupa, Devasreshtha Tryambaka, Savitra, Jayanta, Pinaki and Aparajita. Besides these expansions there are eight forms of Rudra called earth, water, fire, air, sky, the sun, the moon and soma-yaji. Generally all these Rudras have five faces, three eyes and ten arms. Sometimes it is found that Rudra is compared to Brahma and considered a living entity. But when Rudra is explained to be a partial

    expansion of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, he is compared to Shesha. Lord Siva is therefore simultaneously an expansion of Lord Vishnu and, in his capacity for annihilating the creation, one of the living entities. As an expansion of Lord Vishnu he is called Hara, and he is transcendental to the material qualities, but when he is in touch with tamo-guna he appears contaminated by the material modes of nature. This is explained in Shrimad-Bhagavatam and the Brahma-samhita. In Shrimad-Bhagavatam, Tenth Canto, it is stated that Lord Rudra is always associated with the material nature when she is in the neutral, unmanifested stage, but when the modes of material nature are agitated he  Associates with material nature from a distance. In the Brahma-samhita the relationship between Vishnu and Lord Siva is compared to that between milk and yogurt. Milk is converted into yogurt by certain additives, but although milk and yogurt have the same ingredients, they have different functions. Similarly, Lord Siva is an expansion of Lord Vishnu, yet because of his taking part in the annihilation of the cosmic manifestation, he is considered to be changed, like milk converted into yogurt. In the Puranas it is found that Siva appears sometimes from the heads of Brahma and sometimes from the head of Vishnu. The annihilator, Rudra, is born from Sankarshana and the ultimate fire to burn the whole creation. In the Vayu Purana there is a description of Sadasiva in

    one of the Vaikuntha planets. That Sadasiva is a direct expansion of Lord Krishna’s form for pastimes. It is said that Sadasiva (Lord Sambhu) is an expansion from the Sadasiva in the Vaikuntha planets (Lord Vishnu) and that his consort, Mahamaya, is an expansion of Rama-devi, or Lakshmi. Mahamaya is the origin or birthplace of material nature. (CC ADI 6.79)



    He (LORD KRISHNA AND LORD RAMA) likes to worship His devotee. Sometimes the father takes the child on his shoulder. Does it mean the child is more important than the father? They say the Valmiki Ramayana, there is no such incidence as Ramacandra worships Siva. It is later on, interpretation. But even if He does so, what is the wrong here? (conversation 23 dec 1975 mumbai).


    • I think u missed my posts where Lord Krishna worshipped Lord Shiva for thousands of yrs! Not only did he worship him but glorified him as Supreme Brahman. Krishna besides the worship of Lord Shiva goes into details of Shiva's mystery and greatness. Now if you go against Krishna's own words that would be a direct offense right?

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        /* Now if you go against Krishna's own words that would be a direct offense right?*/

        Again valuless interpretation, give us interpretation/purport by Ramanujacharya, Madhvacharya, Vishnuswami, Vallabha, 6 Goswami's... else there is no acceptance  

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    After this follows the most auspicious Rudra Gita, where Shiva glorifies and pays his obeisance to Vishnu. To read Rudra Gita, go through Srimad Bhagavatam 4.24.33. Krishna Himself says in Bhagavad Gita-

    vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyo

    vedānta-kṛd veda-vid eva cāham



     By all the Vedas, I am to be known. Indeed, I am the compiler of Vedānta, and I am the knower of the Vedas.


    When Krishna specifically lays down the goal of Vedas, there should exist no doubt about whether Shiva or Krishna is God or not.  As God Himself speaks, no mental concoction is needed.

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    sva-dharma-niṣṭhaḥ śata-janmabhiḥ pumān

    viriñcatām eti tataḥ paraḿ hi mām

    avyākṛtaḿ bhāgavato 'tha vaiṣṇavaḿ

    padaḿ yathāhaḿ vibudhāḥ kalātyaye


    sva-dharma-niṣṭhaḥ — one who is situated in his own dharma, or occupation; śata-janmabhiḥ — for one hundred births; pumān — a living entity; viriñcatām — the post of Lord Brahmāeti — gets; tataḥ — thereafter; param — above; hi — certainly; mām — attains meavyākṛtam— without deviation; bhāgavataḥ — unto the Supreme Personality of Godhead; atha — therefore; vaiṣṇavam — a pure devotee of the Lord;padam — post; yathā — asaham — Ivibudhāḥ — demigods; kalā-atyaye — after the annihilation of the material world.


    A person who executes his occupational duty properly for one hundred births becomes qualified to occupy the post of Brahmā, and if he becomes more qualified, he can approach Lord Śiva. A person who is directly surrendered to Lord Kṛṣṇa, or Viṣṇu, in unalloyed devotional service is immediately promoted to the spiritual planets. Lord Śiva and other demigods attain these planets after the destruction of this material world.


    This verse gives an idea of the highest perfection of the evolutionary process. As described by the Vaiṣṇava poet Jayadeva Gosvāmī,pralaya-payodhi jale dhṛtavān asi vedam **. Let us begin tracing the evolutionary process from the point of devastation (pralaya), when the whole universe is filled with water. At that time there are many fishes and other aquatics, and from these aquatics evolve creepers, trees, etc. From these, insects and reptiles evolve, and from them birds, beasts and then human beings and finally civilized human beings. Now, the civilized human being is at a junction where he can make further evolutionary progress in spiritual life. Here it is stated (sva-dharma-niṣṭhaḥ) that when a living entity comes to a civilized form of life, there must be sva-dharma, social divisions according to one's work and qualifications. This is indicated in Bhagavad-gītā (4.13):

    cātur-varṇyaḿ mayā sṛṣṭaḿ


    "According to the three modes of material nature and the work ascribed to them, the four divisions of human society were created by Me."

    In civilized human society there must be the divisions of brāhmaṇakṣatriyavaiśya and śūdra, and everyone must properly execute his occupational duty in accordance with his division. Here it is described (svadharma-niṣṭhaḥ) that it does not matter whether one is a brāhmaṇa,kṣatriyavaiśya or śūdra. If one sticks to his position and properly executes his particular duty, he is considered a civilized human being. Otherwise he is no better than an animal. It is also mentioned herein that whoever executes his occupational duty (sva-dharma) for one hundred births (for instance, if a brāhmaṇa continues to act as a brāhmaṇa) becomes eligible for promotion to Brahmaloka, the planet where Lord Brahmā lives. There is also a planet called Śivaloka, or Sadāśivaloka, which is situated in a marginal position between the spiritual and material worlds. If, after being situated in Brahmaloka, one becomes more qualified, he is promoted to Sadāśivaloka. Similarly, when one becomes even more qualified, he can attain the Vaikuṇṭhalokas. The Vaikuṇṭhalokas are targets for everyone, even the demigods, and they can be attained by a devotee who has no desire for material benefit. As indicated in Bhagavad-gītā (8.16), one does not escape material miseries even if he is elevated to Brahmaloka (ābrahma-bhuvanāl lokāḥ punar āvartino 'rjuna). Similarly, one is not very safe even if he is promoted to Śivaloka, because the planet of Śivaloka is marginal. However, if one attains Vaikuṇṭhaloka, he attains the highest perfection of life and the end of the evolutionary process (mām upetya tu kaunteya punar janma na vidyate). In other words, it is confirmed herein that a person in human society who has developed consciousness must take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness in order to be promoted to Vaikuṇṭhaloka or Kṛṣṇaloka immediately after leaving the body. Tyaktvā dehaḿ punar janma naiti mām eti so 'rjuna (Bg. 4.9). A devotee who is fully in Kṛṣṇaconsciousness, who is not attracted by any other loka, or planet, including Brahmaloka and Śivaloka, is immediately transferred to Kṛṣṇaloka (mām eti). That is the highest perfection of life and the perfection of the evolutionary process.

    atha bhāgavatā yūyaḿ

    priyāḥ stha bhagavān yathā

    na mad bhāgavatānāḿ ca

    preyān anyo 'sti karhicit


    atha — therefore; bhāgavatāḥ — devotees; yūyam — all of you; priyāḥ — very dear to mestha — you arebhagavān — the Supreme Personality of Godhead; yathā — asna — neither; mat — than mebhāgavatānām — of the devotees; ca — also; preyān — very dear; anyaḥ— others; asti — there is; karhicit — at any time.


    You(Prachetas) are all devotees of the Lord, and as such I appreciate that you are as respectable as the Supreme Personality of Godhead Himself. I know in this way that the devotees also respect me and that I am dear to them. Thus no one can be as dear to the devotees as I am.


    It is said, vaiṣṇavānāḿ yathā śambhuḥ: Lord Śiva is the best of all devotees. Therefore all devotees of Lord Kṛṣṇa are also devotees of Lord Śiva. In Vṛndāvana there is Lord Śiva's temple called Gopīśvara. The gopīs used to worship not only Lord Śiva but Kātyāyanī, or Durgā, as well, but their aim was to attain the favor of Lord Kṛṣṇa. A devotee of Lord Kṛṣṇa does not disrespect Lord Śiva, but worships Lord Śiva as the most exalted devotee of Lord Kṛṣṇa. Consequently whenever a devotee worships Lord Śiva, he prays to Lord Śiva to achieve the favor ofKṛṣṇa, and he does not request material profit. In Bhagavad-gītā (7.20) it is said that generally people worship demigods for some material profit. Kāmais tais tair hṛta jñānāḥ. Driven by material lust, they worship demigods, but a devotee never does so, for he is never driven by material lust. That is the difference between a devotee's respect for Lord Śiva and an asura's respect for him. The asura worships Lord Śiva, takes some benediction from him, misuses the benediction and ultimately is killed by the Supreme Personality of Godhead, who awards him liberation.

    Because Lord Śiva is a great devotee of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, he loves all the devotees of the Supreme Lord. Lord Śivatold the Pracetās that because they were devotees of the Lord, he loved them very much. Lord Śiva was not kind and merciful only to the Pracetās; anyone who is a devotee of the Supreme Personality of Godhead is very dear to Lord Śiva. Not only are the devotees dear to LordŚiva, but he respects them as much as he respects the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Similarly, devotees of the Supreme Lord also worship Lord Śiva as the most dear devotee of Lord Kṛṣṇa. They do not worship him as a separate Personality of Godhead. It is stated in the list ofnāma-aparādhas that it is an offense to think that the chanting of the name of Hari and the chanting of Hara, or Śiva, are the same. The devotees must always know that Lord Viṣṇu is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and that Lord Śiva is His devotee. A devotee should be offered respect on the level of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and sometimes even more respect. Indeed, Lord Rāma, the Personality of Godhead Himself, sometimes worshiped Lord Śiva. If a devotee is worshiped by the Lord, why should a devotee not be worshiped by other devotees on the same level with the Lord? This is the conclusion. From this verse it appears that Lord Śiva blesses the asuras simply for the sake of formality. Actually he loves one who is devoted to the Supreme Personality of Godhead.

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