I've been struggling with this dilhemma for a bit now. I am in a committed relationship with another woman and we intend to marry and have children. We are torn about whether we should invest in having children in one of three ways:(1) Adoption.(2) Artificial Insemination: I would be the biological mother, with an anonymous sperm donor.(3) in-vitro fertilization: We would both be the biological mothers, with an anonymous sperm donor. My partner's egg would be fertilized by a sperm donor and then the embryo would be injected into my womb.I read somewhere (I don't remember the source) that the Vedas say that adoption is not good. But why? I know that parents must have a god-like mindset while conceiving, but does artificial conception make it any different? Is it wrong to invest so much time and money to bring another child into the world when there are so many born without parents? Please advise on how to make a Krishna Conscious decision.Your aspiring servant,Chalice
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Chalice Mataji is right in her way. The topic here, instead of helping the seeker has turned into her decision about a relationship, which is not our concern.
She has come here for help, so we should tell her which is right and which is wrong.
If we quote examples and abuse the seekers, then there is no meaning to our movement.
I have seen Chalice's profiles, sorry mataji I have to do it. She is very very highly educated and she is right in her own way.
She asked only two questions 1) artificial insemination 2) adoption
I will vote for adoption, so has many other devotees. I think this will answer your query Mataji.
On the funniest part, if you analyze our lives, we are all married for sense gratification only, 99.9%, will you agree ?
According to scriptures, there is no need to get married. One should live a life of celibacy and complete the life span in austerity.
Being a gay, lesbian, or heterosexual everything fall into same category when we see individuals as souls.
If we condemn a gay or lesbian relationship, then being in ISKCON, we are talking about bodily concept of life.
Soul is neither male or female. On the higher platform, we are made to understand that Krsna is the only purusha and every soul is of feminine character.
It is only in Kaliyuga that souls like this have the guts to come out and do what they think is right.
Srila Prabhupada's books give us ultimate knowledge of remaining as a brahmachari and brahmacharinis but due to the uncontrollable desire for sense gratification, he allowed marriages between devotees to bring up KC children.
As the Kaliyuga progresses, the mentality and demands are always new and if ISKCON has taken up to change the world and next generation, then we have to learn to be tolerant.
Though certain things are wrong, a guru gives way for it and that is what elevated devotees like the ones mataji has referred is doing.
Hare Krsna..
Hare Krsna
Sharanagat > 2y6ayw71xpq0qJune 13, 2012 at 12:06am
Hari Bol!
Prabhu jee,
Please explain what is definition of marriage in Hinduism/Vaishnavism? Then, please explain me four regulative principles. A kid without marriage is sin - am I wrong Prabhu jee? I think adoption is allowed for only married couples do not have kids. (let us not talk about higher souls, there will be exception).
Prabhu jee, then tell me how is it correct to suggest adoption?
rakesh roshan > 2y6ayw71xpq0qJune 12, 2012 at 8:31pm
Hare Krsna dear devotees..
humble obeisances
Srila Prabhupada said once clearly that all men should become brahmacaris and all women should get married so I am unable to understand where this injunction of remaining brahmacarinis has come from?
"On the funniest part, if you analyze our lives, we are all married for sense gratification only, 99.9%, will you agree ?"
One very senior celibate told once that sex is not the only reason why people marry, emotional needs and mental support, own space and other reasons are there.
"As the Kaliyuga progresses, the mentality and demands are always new and if ISKCON has taken up to change the world and next generation, then we have to learn to be tolerant."
'
Please can you tell the reference of the statement.
"Being a gay, lesbian, or heterosexual everything fall into same category when we see individuals as souls.
If we condemn a gay or lesbian relationship, then being in ISKCON, we are talking about bodily concept of life."
yes, they fall in the category of soul but it is not that by remaining in that consciousness and doing what our mind and conditioned body says we will be able to get over the diseased state. I heard in a lecture that sex life utilized for Krsna's service causes detachment from it . So that is the purpose it is allowed. We are not criticizing any one for their conditioning but we are saying there is a way to get over that tendency, if we just let our senses do what we want then they will take us to hell.
"It is only in Kaliyuga that souls like this have the guts to come out and do what they think is right."
We can think whatever we like, and we may think that is right, but what shashtras say, if it does not match then it may not be right according to scriptures.
Please do not take any offenses for my statement KA prabhu. I humbly beg forgiveness if my words offended in any way any one. I am not at all qualified but I am just repeating the words that I have heard from the statements of senior devotees.
I think adoption would be excellent as this will benefit both you and ur partner aswell as the child adopted. I don't see anything wrong with adopting a child. I think insemination is abit difficult to ascertain as right or wrong so easily. I think it is wrong and can be right in some situations, but I see no problem at all with adoption.
It is not about lust. It is about regulation. You can love your father, but not have ... One can love her/his mother but cannot have ...
Similarly there are other regulations to observe. There is nothing like a non-regulated life. We all need to follow the upstream and downstream properly and fulfill our duties. As a husband there is duty as a wife there are. As a father one has, as a mother one will. No matter how you look at it - the kid will not have a father. It is not right.
It is not about hate or phobia, if my words are not clear enough.
One devotee once asked HG Radheshyam p, he wanted to join ashram but he had tendencies of homosexuality. He really did not wish to join grihastha ashram but since he had this particular disease, so it was a matter of concern.
The reply that he got was something like this. HG Radheshyam p, contacted a very famous doctor on this matter and asked if it was curable. The doctor said there are 2 different types of the disease- one is curable and the other is incurable. if the devotee was suffering from incurable type of the disease, he must get married and practice a Krsna conscious life and with chanting and sincere practise , he will gradually get over the tendencies. But if it were curable, he could get cured medically,and then join ashram... I guess ,your case is similar.. Please either find if there is a medical cure or else you should marry a man and practice sincerely and chant nicely so that in due course of time, you are able to get over these tendencies.
All in all, it is a must that one gets cured of the disease.. It is not justified to stay with same sex partner under Vedic injunctions, it is against nature and hence is sinful...
No offenses meant.. Plz do not take any offenses...
Replies
Hari Bol! Very aptly put on Tritiya Prakriti Prabhu jee. (and other items too).
Your servant,
Sharanagat
Hare Krsna,
Chalice Mataji is right in her way. The topic here, instead of helping the seeker has turned into her decision about a relationship, which is not our concern.
She has come here for help, so we should tell her which is right and which is wrong.
If we quote examples and abuse the seekers, then there is no meaning to our movement.
I have seen Chalice's profiles, sorry mataji I have to do it. She is very very highly educated and she is right in her own way.
She asked only two questions 1) artificial insemination 2) adoption
I will vote for adoption, so has many other devotees. I think this will answer your query Mataji.
On the funniest part, if you analyze our lives, we are all married for sense gratification only, 99.9%, will you agree ?
According to scriptures, there is no need to get married. One should live a life of celibacy and complete the life span in austerity.
Being a gay, lesbian, or heterosexual everything fall into same category when we see individuals as souls.
If we condemn a gay or lesbian relationship, then being in ISKCON, we are talking about bodily concept of life.
Soul is neither male or female. On the higher platform, we are made to understand that Krsna is the only purusha and every soul is of feminine character.
It is only in Kaliyuga that souls like this have the guts to come out and do what they think is right.
Srila Prabhupada's books give us ultimate knowledge of remaining as a brahmachari and brahmacharinis but due to the uncontrollable desire for sense gratification, he allowed marriages between devotees to bring up KC children.
As the Kaliyuga progresses, the mentality and demands are always new and if ISKCON has taken up to change the world and next generation, then we have to learn to be tolerant.
Though certain things are wrong, a guru gives way for it and that is what elevated devotees like the ones mataji has referred is doing.
Hare Krsna..
Hare Krsna
Hari Bol!
Prabhu jee,
Please explain what is definition of marriage in Hinduism/Vaishnavism? Then, please explain me four regulative principles. A kid without marriage is sin - am I wrong Prabhu jee? I think adoption is allowed for only married couples do not have kids. (let us not talk about higher souls, there will be exception).
Prabhu jee, then tell me how is it correct to suggest adoption?
Your servant,
Sharanagat
Hare Krsna dear devotees..
humble obeisances
Srila Prabhupada said once clearly that all men should become brahmacaris and all women should get married so I am unable to understand where this injunction of remaining brahmacarinis has come from?
"On the funniest part, if you analyze our lives, we are all married for sense gratification only, 99.9%, will you agree ?"
One very senior celibate told once that sex is not the only reason why people marry, emotional needs and mental support, own space and other reasons are there.
"As the Kaliyuga progresses, the mentality and demands are always new and if ISKCON has taken up to change the world and next generation, then we have to learn to be tolerant."
'
Please can you tell the reference of the statement.
"Being a gay, lesbian, or heterosexual everything fall into same category when we see individuals as souls.
If we condemn a gay or lesbian relationship, then being in ISKCON, we are talking about bodily concept of life."
yes, they fall in the category of soul but it is not that by remaining in that consciousness and doing what our mind and conditioned body says we will be able to get over the diseased state. I heard in a lecture that sex life utilized for Krsna's service causes detachment from it . So that is the purpose it is allowed. We are not criticizing any one for their conditioning but we are saying there is a way to get over that tendency, if we just let our senses do what we want then they will take us to hell.
"It is only in Kaliyuga that souls like this have the guts to come out and do what they think is right."
We can think whatever we like, and we may think that is right, but what shashtras say, if it does not match then it may not be right according to scriptures.
Please do not take any offenses for my statement KA prabhu. I humbly beg forgiveness if my words offended in any way any one. I am not at all qualified but I am just repeating the words that I have heard from the statements of senior devotees.
your servant
Hari Bol!
I disagree Prabhujee. We are not looking at the mental and emotional side of unborn soul.
Your servant,
Shanaragat
I think adoption would be excellent as this will benefit both you and ur partner aswell as the child adopted. I don't see anything wrong with adopting a child. I think insemination is abit difficult to ascertain as right or wrong so easily. I think it is wrong and can be right in some situations, but I see no problem at all with adoption.
VOTED / LIKED
Chalice,
Hari Bol!
It is not about lust. It is about regulation. You can love your father, but not have ... One can love her/his mother but cannot have ...
Similarly there are other regulations to observe. There is nothing like a non-regulated life. We all need to follow the upstream and downstream properly and fulfill our duties. As a husband there is duty as a wife there are. As a father one has, as a mother one will. No matter how you look at it - the kid will not have a father. It is not right.
It is not about hate or phobia, if my words are not clear enough.
Your servant,
Sharanagat
Hare Krsna
most humble obeisances
One devotee once asked HG Radheshyam p, he wanted to join ashram but he had tendencies of homosexuality. He really did not wish to join grihastha ashram but since he had this particular disease, so it was a matter of concern.
The reply that he got was something like this. HG Radheshyam p, contacted a very famous doctor on this matter and asked if it was curable. The doctor said there are 2 different types of the disease- one is curable and the other is incurable. if the devotee was suffering from incurable type of the disease, he must get married and practice a Krsna conscious life and with chanting and sincere practise , he will gradually get over the tendencies. But if it were curable, he could get cured medically,and then join ashram... I guess ,your case is similar.. Please either find if there is a medical cure or else you should marry a man and practice sincerely and chant nicely so that in due course of time, you are able to get over these tendencies.
All in all, it is a must that one gets cured of the disease.. It is not justified to stay with same sex partner under Vedic injunctions, it is against nature and hence is sinful...
No offenses meant.. Plz do not take any offenses...
ys
:x
have to ask this question from Senior Devotees.
Same here, really out of head.
Your servant in serving to Srila Prabhupada,
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