Student: Scientists say that their common ground of objectivity is
what they can perceive with their senses.
Srila Prabhupada: Yes, they can perceive things with their senses, but
very imperfectly. They perceive the sand with their senses, but can
they see who has made the sand? Here is the sand, and here is the sea;
they can be seen by direct perception. But how can one directly
perceive the origin of the sand and the sea?
Student: The scientists say that if the sand and the sea were made by
God, we would be able to see Him, just as we can see the sand and the
Srila Prabhupada: Yes, they can see God, but they must get the eyes to
see Him. The shastras say that one must go to a guru to be treated so
that one can understand God. How can they see God with blind eyes?
Student: But seeing God is supramundane. Scientists only consider
Srila Prabhupada: Everything is supramundane. For instance, you may
think there is nothing in the clear sky—that it is vacant—but your
eyes are deficient. In the sky there are innumerable planets you
cannot see because your eyes are limited. Therefore, because it is not
in your power to perceive, you have to accept my word: "Yes, there are
millions of stars out there." Is space vacant because you cannot see
the stars? No. Only the deficiency of your senses leads you to think
Student: The scientists will admit their ignorance of some things, but
they say they cannot accept what they cannot see.
Srila Prabhupada: If they're ignorant, they have to accept knowledge
from someone who knows the truth.
Srila Prabhupada: Everything has been made by someone: the sand has
been made by someone, the water has been made by someone, and the sky
has been made by someone. Krishna consciousness means learning who
that someone is.
Dr. Singh: The scientists will say, "Present that someone to me so I
can see Him."
Srila Prabhupada: And I answer them, "I am presenting that someone to
you, but you have to take the training as well." You have to qualify
your eyes to see that someone. If you are blind, but you do not want
to go to the physician, how will you be cured of your blindness and
see? If one is suffering from cataracts and does not go to the
physician to get his diease cured how will he see? You have to be
treated; that is the injunction.
Student: That step requires faith.
Srila Prabhupada: Yes, but not blind faith—practical faith. If you
want to learn anything, you must go to an expert. Correct? That is not
blind faith; it is practical faith. You cannot learn anything by
Student: If somebody is actually sincere, will he always meet a bona fide guru?
Srila Prabhupada: Yes. Guru-krishna-prasade paya bhakti-lata-bija
[Chaitanya-charitamrita Madhya 19.151]. Krishna is within you, and as
soon as He sees that you are sincere, He will send you to the right
Student: And if you are not completely sincere, you will get a cheater
for a teacher?
Srila Prabhupada: Yes. If you want to be cheated, Krishna will send
you to a cheater. Krishna is superintelligent. If you are a cheater,
He will cheat you perfectly. But if you are actually sincere, then He
will give you the right guidance. In Bhagavad-gita (15.15) Krishna
says, sarvasya chaham hridi sannivishto mattah smritir jnanam apohanam
cha: "I am seated in everyone's heart, and from Me come remembrance,
knowledge and forgetfulness." Krishna speaks of both remembrance and
forgetfulness. If you are a cheater, Krishna will give you the
intelligence to forget Him forever.
Student: Srila Prabhupada, one librarian wanted me to prove that
Bhagavad-gita was five thousand years old. He wanted to see a copy
that was written down five thousand years ago.
Srila Prabhupada: Suppose I go into a dark room and say to the person
inside, "The sun has risen. Come out!" The person in darkness may say,
"Where is the proof that there is light? First prove it to me; then I
will come out." I may plead with him, "Please, please, just come out
and see." But if he does not come out to see, he remains ignorant
always waiting for the proof.
Morning walk conversations
(Life comes from Life - CH 15)