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An article entitled “When the Husband is Not a Devotee,” written by Sundari Radhika Dasi for The Eight Petals newsletter and published on ISKCON News recently, caused a firestorm of controversy.
The article, which you can read along with its comments here, posed the question, “What if a woman is married to a man who is not a devotee?” The author—who qualified her answer by stating that it assumed “the husband is a normal man and not a homicidal maniac”—then went on to state that “all women have just one duty or dharma in this world—to serve her husband.” This she referred to as “stri-dharma.”
Sundari Radhika says in her article that any husband, whether he is “qualified” or not, is a direct representative of Krishna and the wife should serve him no matter what. She even goes so far as to say, “If the husband wants her to serve him meat, alcohol, sex, etc, she should serve him,” thus seeming to give men leeway to do whatever they want.
While some readers commenting on the article agreed with elements of it, most found it immature, unrealistic, and imbalanced.
For a more balanced view on the subject, ISKCON News approached Krsnanandini Dasi, who along with her husband Tariq Ziyad is a member of the Grihasta Vision Team (GVT), a group of certified marriage and family therapists dedicated to the health of ISKCON devotee marriages.
Prevention is Better than Cure
One of the GVT’s strongest recommendations, which Krsnanandini advocates before anything else, is that both female and male devotees do everything they can before marriage to make sure they get a partner who is compatible with them in Krishna consciousness and in everything else in life. This eliminates the kind of
husband, and difficulties with him, that Sundari Radhika talks about in her article.
As they say, ‘An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.’
“We like to encourage devotees to get at least ten to twelve hours of pre-marital education with qualified marriage and family educators who themselves have healthy Krishna conscious marriages,” Krsnanandini says. “Examine what both of your motives are, what your goals are, and look realistically at your expectations of each other. What roles do you see yourselves playing? For instance, the traditional role of a wife may be to cook, clean and do the laundry, but what if she works full-time just like the man? It’s also important to learn good communication and conflict resolution skills, to deal with some of the baggage that both people bring from their families of origin, and even to discuss how you will manage your finances.”
A Mature Approach
Of course, there may be cases where such a ‘prepared marriage’ is not possible—for instance, if an already-married woman becomes a devotee, and her husband does not.
It’s important to find the right advice from a mature devotee who truly cares about your welfare in this kind of situation, as illustrated by an example Krsnanandini gives, which shows that there is sometimes still a shocking lack of understanding about our philosophy even in today’s ISKCON.
“I recently introduced a new devotee to Krishna consciousness,” Krsnanandini says. “She was so excited, studying and learning about the philosophy, and finally went to stay at an ISKCON temple. While she was there, however, one of the devotees told her that she would have to leave her husband in order to be a real devotee!”
Close to tears, the woman called Krsnanandini, who advised her to be careful with devotees who were sincere but lacked understanding. She then reminded her that her husband was a good man who supported her being a devotee, even though he had not chosen to be one himself; and that they had a good relationship.
“To me, this is a very good, healthy and favorable situation for you to continue practicing Krishna consciousness in,” Krsnanandini said. “And if you continue to be a good wife and a good example, your husband may gradually feel more and more inclined to appreciate some of the things that you’re doing to become a more purified person.”
At these words, the woman felt hopeful.
The same mature approach is recommended for cases where there are problems in marriages where both partners are devotees.
“There was one Vaishnava couple whom I worked with as a marriage and family educator, where one spouse didn’t want to have sex anymore, and the other was not quite able to do that,” Krsnanandini says. “Both, however, were sincere devotees trying to make progress in spiritual life. So should the spouse that doesn’t want to have sex leave? No! They should see this as something Krishna wants them to work out together, to help each other.”
Even in a situation where an already-married woman becomes a devotee, and her husband is completely unfavorable and unsupportive, Krsnanandini would recommend working on the relationship, rather than any hasty separation. We should see our service to our husbands and wives as devotional service which pleases the Lord, and be careful not to simply quit the marriage any time there’s a problem.
“A Chaste Woman is Advised Not to Agree to Serve Such a Husband”
However, disagreeing with Sundari Radhika’s perspective that a wife should serve her husband no matter what, the Vedas say that all acts must be performed according to ‘desa, kala, patra’—time, place and circumstance. ISKCON Founder Srila Prabhupada cited this many times in conversations and in his purports such as that to Srimad-Bhagavatam 7.14.34.
“With mature, intelligent consideration, we should figure out how to properly apply scriptural principles in our particular situation,” Krsnanandini says. “Prabhupada often said that details can be adjusted or changed, but principles cannot. When a devotee asked him, ‘How do we know the difference between a principle and a detail?’ he thought for a moment and then replied, ‘It requires some intelligence.’ So Prabhupada wanted us to use our intelligence, rather than to follow blindly.”
Thus, the scriptural injunction—in Krishna consciousness as well as across most spiritual paths—is that once one gets married, one should not get divorced.
“However, if our spouse—in this case, the husband—perpetuates repeated and prolonged instances of degraded and immoral conduct that renders the devotee wife unable to continue her service to Krishna,” says Krsnanandini, “Then she can separate from that man.”
For Vaishnavas in the Chaitanya tradition, Sanatana-Dharma—or reconnecting the conditioned soul with Krishna—trumps all other types of dharma, including stri-dharma.
Thus, while we respect stri-dharma, the overarching question in everything we do should be “What is most advantageous to my making progress in Krishna consciousness?”
In this connection, the Sri Chaitanya Charitamrita, 15.265, clearly states, “When a husband is fallen, one’s relationship with him must be given up.”
In the purport to Srimad-Bhagavatam 7.11.28, Srila Prabhupada gives a direct answer to Sundari Radhika’s claim that “If the husband wants her to serve him meat, alcohol, sex, etc, she should serve him.” Prabhupada writes, “A chaste woman is advised not to agree to serve such a husband. It is not that a chaste woman should be like a slave while her husband is naradhama, the lowest of men.”
In the Chaitanya Charitamrita, the great devotee Sarvabhauma Bhattacarya says, “Inform my daughter Sathi to abandon her relationship with her husband because he has fallen down. When the husband falls down, it is the wife’s duty to relinquish the relationship.”
Krsnanandini reminds us that of course, separation such as this should never be done lightly, but only after very deep reflection, consideration, and advice from elders in the community that one trusts and respects.
“Men Want their Wife to be Sita, But they Don’t Want to be Rama.”
Interestingly, in his purport to the Chaitanya Charitamrita verse about Sarvabhauma’s daughter, Prabhupada quotes Srimad-Bhagavatam 5.5.18: “One cannot be a husband if he cannot liberate his dependents from inevitable death.” Prabhupada also states that “If a person is not in Krishna consciousness and is bereft of spiritual power, he cannot protect his wife from the path of repeated birth and death. Consequently such a person cannot be accepted as a husband.”
Prabhupada also writes in the Srimad Bhagavatam 4.26.17: “Actually, the woman must always be protected by her husband. We always speak of the Goddess of Fortune as being placed on the chest of Narayana. In other words, the wife must remain embraced by her husband. Thus she becomes beloved and well protected.”
This shows that the husband also has a very serious duty to protect and serve his wife. It does not endorse a one-sided, unhealthy relationship as Sundari Radhika seems to do in her article, with comments such as this one: “The wife should not be rude, critical or fight with the husband, as this would be greater than any sin he may possess. His faults should be dealt with by his superiors or equals, not by his subordinate (his wife).”
“There tends to be so much expectation of the woman,” says Krsnanandini. “But what is the expectation of the man? If you want a healthy Krishna conscious marriage, you need both a good wife, and the kind of husband that the wife can respect and appreciate. As ISKCON guru Radhanath Swami says, ‘Men want their wife to be Sita, but they don’t want to be Rama.’”
In a healthy relationship, Krsnanandini explains, the wife wants to serve the husband, and the husband wants to serve the wife—service is a mutual expression of love. In the ancient text Ramayana, when Lord Rama was banished from his kingdom to the forest, he wanted his wife Sita to stay behind, out of concern that the forest life would be too hard for her. But when she insisted that she wanted come with him, he honored her desire. Meanwhile, when Sita was kidnapped by the handsome and powerful Ravana, she remained faithful to Rama. And he literally crossed oceans and destroyed armies to protect her.
In the Srimad-Bhagavatam, Kardama Muni and his wife Devahuti are also cited as the ideal husband and wife. Devahuti, a princess, devotedly served her husband Kardama, who was an ascetic, to the point where she forgot about her own needs and became thin and malnourished. Wanting to serve her in return, Kardama gave her the family—nine children—and security that she wanted, creating no less than a flying city for her with palaces, gardens, and maidservants! This kind of reciprocation makes for a healthy, loving marriage.
Steer Clear of Misconceptions with Mature Guidance
Finally, in responding to Sundari Radhika’s article, it is important to discuss her citing of Srila Prabhupada’s sister, Pishima, as an example of why women should serve their husbands no matter what kind of a person they are.
According to the article, Pishima’s husband was “a rogue, meat eater, he drank alcohol, he was a woman-hunter, spending money on gambling, etc.” The article then states that when Pishima asked Prabhupada what to do, “he advised her to do what she learned from her mother—to serve her husband, and to pray to Sri Krishna for the best interest of her husband. And not to argue with her husband.” According to the article, this was successful, and eventually Pishima’s husband changed his ways.
In her own words, the author also says that Prabhupada “didn’t advise her to divorce her husband, or to complain to various women’s ministries about him.”
Using this story out of context, and along with such personal commentary, is dangerous, and seems to insinuate that women should stay in an abusive situation and not get help.
“Both Srila Prabhupada and his sister Pishima were pure devotees,” says Krsnanandini. “If a great soul is able to stay with a fallen husband and triumph, that doesn’t mean we should copy them. We are directed by the scriptures to follow the example of pure devotees in the sense of their service to the Lord—but never to imitate them. As Prabhupada said, Lord Shiva can drink an ocean of poison, but we cannot, and so we should not try to copy him.”
Krsnanandini warns that we cannot artificially see our sister suffering in an abusive relationship and say “It’s okay, they’re doing their dharma.” When we are taught to be concerned about an animal being tortured, how can we sit idly by while one of our fellow devotees is tortured? That is not Krishna consciousness.
“And no one should stay in a dangerous or abusive relationship without seeking the help of other Vaishnavas who are concerned about their welfare,” Krsnanandini adds. “Ministries like Vaishnavas CARE and the ISKCON Women’s Ministry are there for devotees to reach out to. And they exist because unfortunately the issue of women being abused even in our own movement still exists.”
Thus devotees who are looking to have healthy Krishna conscious marriages should steer clear of misconceptions about the philosophy by taking the guidance of mature, qualified persons. The Grihasta Vision Team, for instance, consists entirely of senior devotee couples who have been in successful marriages for a long time and who are also certified marriage and family educators.
The Team offers an in-depth seminar on relationship skills called Strengthening the Bonds that Free Us, as well as one-on-one services such as pre-marital education to couples, both in person and over the phone. Next year, they will release Heart and Soul Connections, an honest, practical and spiritually grounded book on how to have healthy, joyous marriages in Krishna consciousness. They also travel to different communities to train couples in how to become mentor marriage educators in their own community.
“The other day, my husband and I were at the Sunday Feast in ISKCON Chicago, and at least three couples came up to us and thanked us, telling us that a seminar we gave seven years ago helped them so much!” says Krsnanandini. “So both such education, and healthy discussions like the one Sundari Radhika’s article inspired, are very effective in assisting devotees to navigate good, Krishna conscious relationships.”
Hare Krishna Maral mataji.please accept my humble obiensances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada. Thank u so much for posting this link . I feel situations differ from couple to couple.In my own case i have taken to krishna conciousness after marriage and my husband is also quite supportive. He attends the satsangs, whenever he is in town, in Fact satsang started at our house and he lovingly and enthusiastically served the vaishnavas and bramhacharis that came at our place. However satsang had to be shifted to other devotees place due to some unavoidable reasons. He even accompanied us last week in prabhat pheri(Nagar Sankirtan). Initially just before we could start his mind hesitated for he thought if people saw him with iskcon devotees ,they may say bad things about iskcon because of him. For the present year he has promised Lord Balaji that he wont have alcohol or meat.But for my surprise he has just recently taken up to smoking. I feel he is like water whatever colour u put in he becomes like that. He talks about having beautiful deities at home But when he approaches his bad company evrything goes in vain. He is a very good human for he goes out of way to help people around him in trouble. And due to all these reasons i dont understand how to deal with the bad side of his.He has very very bad company of meat eaters ,alcoholics and some even women hunters. Ifeel his friends are his first priority .I always pray Lord Krishna that he help my husband so that he serriously takes to Krishna conciousness and become a pure devotee.We dont know what are Krishnas plans.I feel very dejected at times. I dont understand what to do.
Hare Krishna dear Geeta Mataji,
please accept my humble obeisances! All glories to Srila Prabhupada!
The best thing which You are doing is that You are considering him very good.
And it is very important. In the reality chaste woman's power is the second after God's. If You remain chaste to him for sure some day he will be changed. It says that chaste wife can make from a fool wise, from a rascal very nice gentlemen.... so it is possible.
And whole life is there to materialize this in our life. Whole life is an exam. Good things usually are achieved slowly. As like Ayurvedic medicine. Alopathic drugs may cure the disease immediately but creates other diseases in the side but Ayurvedic medicine cures slowly but from the root.
Chaste woman has a mystic power. How she will think of her husband he will become like that.
If she considers him a rascal, lazy...then he will become like that. But when she believes and prays and tries to see his even though tiny good, manly qualities she can help her husband to cultivate those qualities only.
Start with small things. But small things play big role in our life:
Please remember that if man does not find happiness and satisfaction at home in the company of his care taking wife he will search for that in the outside world.
So remembering that wife should do her best in order to make him happy at his home.
So it starts with
----greeting a husband when he enters home. Wife should decorate herself with nice, fresh dress-saree, maybe to put some flowers to her hair for a nice smell, some earrings...beautiful and smiling face...and respectful words when he comes inside the home. So seeing such like respect husband become so happy. But of course she should not wear in such a way so that she increase his lusty desires but in the mode of goodness. Having a look of a weak but charming girl who needs to be protected by her husband...
----saying pleasing words, asking of his mood, "Dear" "Honey" "my Prabhu"....so many words....
"Please"..."You are so brave!"..."How would i live if You were not there in my life..." "i love You"....
(please remember that he works so hard with karmi people, so it is not easy to keep proper consciousness, because of that he may be weak in his spiritual life but for that wife should make her house a Temple so that at least when he comes home he will refresh his consciousness...)
----food always should prepared right on time or else it will also disturb him...before that wife can prepare bathroom if he wants to take bath....then clean cloth....
----so food part is very important. Wife should cook food for the pleasure of Krishna without any slefish desires. She should not wait for some encouragement from the side of her husband but to cook that in order to please Krishna and then her family members. No selfishness in the form of waiting for words like "oh food was so nice!...."
Husband may not say anything about food but after many such like things automatically he starts to become grateful. Because Krishna is in the heart of everyone. When He is pleased He only changes the hears of people.
And one more secret: after 6-7 various types of lunches husband automatically will desire to gift something for his wife. Or to fulfill her desire. So that time wife may request to leave smoking or something like that...
How should be request?
---Dear, i love You so much when You are at home after Your job. But if You still love to visit Your friends it is Your right, i am not someone who orders You something. But i really love You at home when we together do seva...but You please decide whatever to do, i will be agree with Your decision.
----Dear, i love You so much and because of that i want You to be healthy. Smoking is not good for Your health and i am little bit worried about it. But still it is Your own choice, i can not go against You. But i really love You to be healthy and happy...Also we could have healthy kids if we are healthy, aren't we?! (with charming smile :)
----wife should chant some rounds for her family members. And read Srila Prabhupada's books and dedicate the result for them.
----she should pray Krishna to protect her family members.
----she should always think good of her family members.
----better not to tell intimate secrets of a husband to anyone. Even to close friends.
---and do not lie to a husband but be honest. If some problems in mind wife should not keep it on mind but find proper time and open her heart to her husband and request him to help her in that situation. She should depend on his guidance. So that he could feel that he is needed in the family. He will know that at least one person - my wife needs me so i will do anything and everything in order to make her happy.
----she should be satisfied with whatever husband is earning. And try not to waste any grain.
uhhh
:D
hope it will help!
Your servant
Hare Krishna Maral mataji. Please accept My Humble Obiensances.All glories to Srila Prabhupada. Thank u so much mataji for your valuable guidance. I will surely try to follow ur some new advices since ive being following ur guidance given to other matajis previously , since long and i know it is helping. But when it comes to any kind of addiction I just cant tolerate and I become wild.I know that yelling and screaming etc doesnt help but still i lose my patience as it happened yesterday night also as he was drunk. Now im repenting. I surely try to follow ur so nice and encouraging advice and keep in mind that I should give him some more time. Thank u so much mataji for sparing so much time for a fallen being like me.Hare Krishna.
my humble obeisances dear Geeta Mataji, All glories to Sri Guru and Gauranga!
oh You see to what extent came the relationships.....
Usually there are several steps of family destruction. These are not my words. I do not have any experience of family life yet, at least in this life time. But i hear lectures of Devotee physiologists ...so they help me. Anyways let's see the stages of family degradation:
Family can be protected only by chaste wife and vise versa it would be destroyed also by unqualified wife. So no matter what kind of husband is that woman has power given by God to protect her family from destruction.
---in the beginning stage sometime wife gets upset to a husband. It happens in daily life so it is known problem. So that time many women do same mistake. They keep that grievance inside their heart. They do not tell it to a husband but just swallow it. So it is a mistake and it is a beginning of betraying a husband.
So solution is if he hurts even little bit wife should find a suitable time when husband is peaceful and explain nicely that she did not liked his this and this actions. And that they are disturbing her. And request him not to do that further but not with ordering mood but as a weak child requesting his mother...
----if grievance is there many times for idle things in wife as an answer husband starts to become angry. It is automatically - it is psychology.
---then in order to protect herself from husband's anger wife starts to become fearful and start to lie him. That is worse. When she lies as an answer he starts to dislike her and looses trust. Becomes more angry and dissatisfied with life. So starts to look for satisfaction in outside world or in bad habits.
----when he starts to loose his interest for job, no money, bad habits...wife becomes disturbed and starts to insult him. The worst is she starts to use harsh words...and that leads for even physical fights. Husband starts to beat his wife.
HARSH WORDS of a wife are like a poison to a husband. He can not tolerate that.
---and to beat a wife is the worst thing. Woman is a small representative of Mother Lakshmi - Goddess of Fortune so when he starts to beat her he looses everything in the society, in his life...job, prestige...respect...
and whose faults was that? Wife. She acted in such a way that because of her actions husband started to beat her and when husband is down wife is left unprotected. And for her also life is very difficult.
Then she herself starts to work, earn money, gains manly qualities....and husband becomes like a big kid if they did not divorced. No intelligence ...
So solution is to understand in which place we did these mistakes and try to correct them.
if harsh words then we have to work on that. If no respect then again we have to work on that.
If he is drinking and smoking please start with accepting him as he is.
Do not try to change him. Let him smoke and drink. Just forcible and with harsh words it is not cured. On the contrary he will become more and more like that. It is not a solution.
---accepting him as his is and pray for him. Talk to him nice words. When he does something manly like goes to his job or helps You in doing some hard tasks at home...You have to say to him how is brave, strong...how You need him in Your life. That You belong to him....
So in this way he will cultivate those qualities. And when You act as a woman with little womanly weakness he will have desire to protect You.
So summary is:
---please accept him as he is.
---forgive him.
---pray for him.
---wish all good to him.
---try to be honest, no secret from him.
---tolerate his bad qualities and appreciate good ones.
---cook on time and very special foods Prasadam.
i am not one who should give advices but accept it from my Shiksha Gurus.
Your servant,
Hare krishna mataji. Please accept my humble obiesances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada. Im sorry I couldnt reply in time for i coldnt access the sitr for some technical reasons. Thank u so much for sparing so much time for me. Im sorry i have to go. I will reply later.
Hare Krishna Maral mataji.Please accept my humble obiensances.All glories to Srila Prabhupada. My prabhuji told me that he wont go out daily with friends and will come home early but he will surely go for social drinking, when his company meetings are there and I should allow him for the same. I didnt know what to say I didnt reply. I just remembered your words. "accept ur husband as he is". And I have decided to follow this. But I cant do this without Krishnas help and blessings from true and pure devotees like u.Thank u . Your advice Has given me Peace of mind. Hare Krishna.
my humble obeisances dear Geeta Mataji,
do You have good Internet? If so please watch this: http://www.iskcondesiretree.net/group/ladies-in-iskcon/forum/topics...
Your servant,