I remember Prabhupada writing that one attains Brahma Nirvana as soon as they go back to Godhead. I see this happening as one returning directly to their constitutional position as they re-enter the stream of Eternity, and in this case "Brahma Nirvana" is God's direct will and them following it at all times. They would also get Eternal Krishna Prema as well, full Love of Krishna, never to fall back down again into the material world, as Prabhupada has said once someone puts their hand into the fire of the material world, then goes back to Godhead, they do not put it in a second time because they are intelligent.

As for those that are not fully fallen from Godhead but are simply captivated by the glow of the material effulgence, but can still fall, why it it that they are not given the same provisions as someone who goes back to Godhead never to fall again? I know Krishna especially works to retrieve His fallen devotees, but I would like this question answered from what anyone here thinks, because as it is said in the Bhagavad Gita, once one returns to Krishna's abode, they never fall back into this miserable world ever again. Yet there is repeated birth and death, and children are born from the Spiritual World. And when an adult becomes a demon or someone who does not follow the rules of God, they fall, and then have to return to Godhead. That's what our movement is for, bringing back the fallen and spreading Krishna Consciousness. It is difficult for many demons to achieve liberation, even though they all eventually do, because they cannot take another birth until they go back to Godhead. There are no evil babies. Let me know what you think.

Hare Krishna.

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  • Here is what Prabhupad says about Brahma Nirvana:

    BG 2.72, Purport

    Nirvāṇa means ending the process of materialistic life. According to Buddhist philosophy, there is only void after the completion of this material life, but Bhagavad-gītā teaches differently. Actual life begins after the completion of this material life. For the gross materialist it is sufficient to know that one has to end this materialistic way of life, but for persons who are spiritually advanced, there is another life after this materialistic life. Before ending this life, if one fortunately becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious, he at once attains the stage of brahma-nirvāṇa. There is no difference between the kingdom of God and the devotional service of the Lord. Since both of them are on the absolute plane, to be engaged in the transcendental loving service of the Lord is to have attained the spiritual kingdom. In the material world there are activities of sense gratification, whereas in the spiritual world there are activities of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Attainment of Kṛṣṇa consciousness even during this life is immediate attainment of Brahman, and one who is situated in Kṛṣṇa consciousness has certainly already entered into the kingdom of God.

    ...And if you read some of the other selections, which I recommend you do, it says that Brahma Nirvana is when one is completely absorbed in the Supreme Lord, free from material pangs. So it is synonymous with Krishna-Prema or the Vasudeva Stage. Read here: https://vaniquotes.org/wiki/Brahma-nirvana

    My question was that I once read by Prabhupada that one attains Brahma Nirvana immediately when going back to Godhead. Then how does one not get such a blessing before the fall if they are in danger of falling from Godhead and need that blessing as well? What is holding them back then? That is the question I want answered. Thank you very much.

    Hare Hare Krishna.

    • "If one advances further from the brahma-nirvāṇa platform, one enters the stage of devotional service (mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām)."

      There is next step after brahma nirvana ...that is performing devotional service.

      Please read this completely..https://vaniquotes.org/wiki/Brahma-nirvana

      If one gets a chance to become KC before dying but cannot perform devotional service. he is said to be in brahma nirvana state. Then such a person will get another chance to perform devotional service and fully dedicate his life for Krishna and after which he goes back to Kingdom of God.

      See... for example.-- let me say I am living like this without knowing who krishna is also.. till my end of this life and just before my death I came to know who krishna is and understood HIS greatness,.. but I didn't have chance to surrender to Lord completely or perform atonement of my sins by chanting or doing sufficient devotional activities.. and died. I am now in a stage of Brahma nirvana already when I died. Becoz I my search of Lord has ended.  I understood who is the person I must surrender to. So I get another life time to do sufficient atonement of sins and also get a chance to do required devotional service and go back to Godhead.

      Now you have got in this life time to know Krishna and you are doing devotional activities and chanting also. Then you are going to the next level.

      You are already Blessed by Lord that is why you are remembering Lord.

      I am seated in everyone's heart, and from Me come remembrance, knowledge and forgetfulness. By all the Vedas am I to be known; indeed I am the compiler of Vedanta, and I am the knower of the Vedas.( 15.15 BG),

      Lord is present in animate and inanimate things then why only humans have the chance to take his name? and out of many people only you are blessed to take Lord's name? It means you got blessing of Lord already.. just that you have to complete your karma and go back to Godhead.

      hare krishna.

       

       

      Brahma-nirvana - Vaniquotes
      • That makes a lot of sense. In one place Prabhupada mentions Brahma Nirvana as complete absorbtion in Krishna Consciousness, and in another as a step before it. This comes from presenting the philosophers that are caught in the views of impersonal realization, Prabhupada uses their own definition of Brahma Nirvana as a stepping stone in explaining full Krishna Consciousness. I personally believe that attainment of Brahman means the attainment of Krishna, as Krishna is Brahman, Parabrahman, Spirit. Aham Bramhasmi. The Vaisnava definition of Brahman is one who understands Brahman, and Brahman is Krishna. Of course, the Brahman effulgence is something the impersonalists often attempt to merge into, while our goal is staying in a Spiritual Body to personally associate with the Lord on Krishna-Loka.

        The Buddha also preached that after Nirvana there is a state of Love that is meant to be attained. Here is an excerpt from the Lotus Sutra, from the second chapter, Expedient Means:

        For these reasons, Shariputra,
        I have for their sake established expedient means,
        preaching the way that ends all suffering.
        And showing them nirvana.
        But although I preach nirvana,
        this is not a true extinction.
        All phenomena from the very first
        have of themselves constantly borne the marks of
        tranquil extinction.
        Once the sons of the Buddha have carried out this path,
        then in a future existence they will be able to become Buddhas.

        ...what the Buddha means by this is that all phenomena have within them the capacity for Buddhahood.

        One time I personally asked Guatama Buddha when He was in my presence what this passage meant, and He simply replied "I know what true extinction is." And showed me a mandala through meditation of Golden beautiful light and Love that symbolized God and that was emination of God. So true extinction, or liberation from this material world is God-Consciousness. And as we know from the Srimad Bhagavatam Lord Buddha is an Avatar of Krishna.

        My question is that since one never comes back to this material world once reaching Krishna's Supreme abode as it says in the Bhagavad Gita, what is the reason that, originally in the Spiritual World the same souls didn't get the benediction of not being able to fall before they fell that they got since once retuning? If anyone is able to answer this that would be great.

        • Well, It is not worth discussing about how we got here to material world. How to get back is more important that is what Srila Prabhupada said.

          You may want to read further under this.

          http://www.krishna.com/where-do-fallen-souls-fall

          Where Do The Fallen Souls Fall From? | Krishna.com
          • Thank you. I have read this article a number of times and just read it again. What Prabhupada says is entirely true, but there is a stage of discussion that is important to get to once one gets free of the material clutches and returns to the Spiritual World. My take on it is that once a soul goes back to Godhead, Krishna employs a causless loving mechanism that won't let the practitioner fall again, no matter what, putting them through a process that will Eternally keep them in Krishna Consciousness. Krishna is like a lifeguard saving someone from drowning, and once they recover their natural propensity in the Spiritual World they will stay in their constitutional position of devotional service forever, not wanting to drown again, being full of True Love that will never go away.

            Om bhur bhuvaha svaha
            Tat savitur varenyam
            Bhargo devasya dhimahi
            Dhiyo yonah prachodayat.
            • And if one asks why it happens in such a way my answer is that the material world is so bad that it leaves a certain imprint on the Jiva that fell so that once they receive Krishna's Eternal mercy back at Godhead they will decide not to fall again. Krishna would never impose the pain of the material world on anyone at Godhead. And it is evident that the material world is full of suffering. What's so bad about it is all around us while we're here. Instead of deciding to learn by Spiritual Means some decided to get caught in the material effulgence and fall. After learning fully by Spiritual Means, one will never fall again or in the first place. God Bless. Hare Krishna.

              • Do you think you can free yourself from the material clutches and return to Spiritual World all by urself?

                Similarly do you think all this whole drama of the Universe is happening without intervention of Lord?

                Nothing is happening without HIS involvement.

                Even if we go back to Godhead also.. If Lord says come with me let me do leela and you take part with me in the leela.?? will you stop and say no no? I will stay in goloka only?

                So..? first point is..we are not nitya siddhas. We are marginal entities or Nitya badhhas. At max we can become sadhana siddha devotees and attain a position of being a subservient to the nitya siddha bhakts.

                Can you think of being Nitya siddha devotee????????????? NO NEVER

                We can be servant to servants or maids to maids of Nitya siddhas. and maids to maids can always fall down.

                Becoz maids can never become so perfect like masters.

                Now Who are nitya Siddhas?

                Nitya Siddhas are those intimate devotees of lord like Shrimati Radha rani, mata Yashoda, nand maharaj and other gopi's and all the gopa balaks.  We can aspire to become at maxium the servants of these great selfless devotees. So we can always fall short when we do service to them. Becoz we are servants. We do mistakes.. But Krishna is very very very merciful.. even if we fall from such a high position also He takes utmost care to see that His devotees come back to HIM carefully.

                Hare Krishna

              • "The disciple is not above his master: but every one that is perfect shall be as his master."

                -Holy Bible, Luke 6:40

                Whether one descended from the Spiritual World as a Siddha or fell at some point, or came down in a compromise, then to regain their Krishna Consciousness doesn't make them different from Krishna's intimate devotees, once the perfectional stage is reached. Krishna is the Source of all eminations, of the demigods and the Original Person, and He is God. Jesus Christ of Nazareth was on the same level as God the Father, and the Christians believe that as part of the Trinity, Jesus Christ is God as well. Are not all things possible with God, as it says in the Bible? God is Omnipotent. So no matter how fallen one has been, it is possible for them to return to Godhead and be as dear to Krishna even as Radharani is, completely on Her level, for in the Spiritual World 1+1=1 and 1-1=1, as Prabhupad has stated. Hare Krishna.

                • But we must be careful. Prabhupada has said that "as soon as one considers himself as a master, he starts to fall." So never forget that you are a Spiritual Master, not just a master, and that is why you are in our movement.

  • Hare Krishna,

    There are different levels or platforms the devotee may merge into.

    1. Nirvana  2. Brahma Nirvana 3. Parmatma. 4. Bhagwan.

    1.  Niravana- The Buddha philosophy teaches nirvāṇa, devoid of all material desires.

    2 Brahma Nirvana- Advaita Philosophy teaches us about Brahma Nirvana. The impersonalist who don't believe in Lord's personal form all come under this category. They just aim at merging the soul or Atman into the efflugence or the Brahman of Lord the rays coming from the Lord's personal form. the brahman efflugence. They cannot reach Supreme Personality of Godhead becoz they main aim is reaching only the brahman efflugence and merging their atman ( soul) into that.

    4. Parmatma realization-- Soul and Supersoul are like two birds sitting on a tree. They are made of same quality but quantitative size of the soul is much much smaller compared to supersoul. Self realization that I am not this body, I am soul and I am subservient to the Supersoul. I ( soul) belong to the Supersoul. This realization is Parmatma realization.

    5. Bhagawan realization- One who has understood that Bhagwan is Supreme Personality of Godhead one who is with a beautiful form. Those who are devotees of Lord can only realize this stage.

    So its a step by step process.. 
    Sarva dharman parityajam...( leaving all desires, and other dharmas) till this step is the Nirvana stage. Knowing self that I am not this body I am the soul..( second step realization) that is the Brahma Niravana stage.

    Then comes the I the soul am part and parcel of the Supreme soul.. ( Parmatma realization).

    Next step is the BHAGAWAN realization. It is a step by step process. you cannot get to the final step without passing thru all the initial steps.

    At any stage other then ( EXCEPT) Bhagwan realization there is every possiblity of falling back to mortal world.

    Once you realized Supreme Personality of Godhead there is no turning back.

    Once you realized Supreme Personality or the Bhagwan that means you have passed rest all steps. ( ie.; Nirvana, Brahama nirvana, parmatma realization).

    Hare Krishna

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